Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Ramsus on Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:47 am

I believe it becomes an issue of strength of those things. First minor. Then not-minor. Could be wrong though. Kindulitter will have to show us an example for the first one with the current ideas the really be able to tell.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  LoganAura on Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:08 am

First tier: Basically? Think small. You won't be able to blast that big enemy with a "Turn into a kitty" Spell even with a cmc +100, but you can make the floor slippery to help escape, or give a pony a beard.

Second Tier: Think BIG. Now you can turn the eldritch abomination into a foal, or trace the big bad's scrying on you- just so long as you roll high enough.

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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Xel Unknown on Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:15 am

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:I don't know what you're talking about. That edit has always been there. I swear. Smile
Not yet on the Genetic Engie doc. XD
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:36 pm

Lies!

Wow, I seriously missed both those things. Thanks for pointing it out. jocolor
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:37 pm

LoganAura wrote:First tier: Basically? Think small. You won't be able to blast that big enemy with a "Turn into a kitty" Spell even with a cmc +100, but you can make the floor slippery to help escape, or give a pony a beard.

Second Tier: Think BIG. Now you can turn the eldritch abomination into a foal, or trace the big bad's scrying on you- just so long as you roll high enough.

One person's big is another's miniscule. Breaking them up based on "is it big or not" leaves it just as vague, confusing, and conflicting as the original. Unless someone plans on coming up with a comprehensive list, which I doubt.

That's why my suggestion was more clearly defined. "Making it up" vs, "Augmenting and already established effect" cannot be debated. At least not as much.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:50 pm

And it also doesn't solve the problem of the "making it up for just one utility talent" being overpowered the way it's intended to be used.

The augmentation hasn't hurt anyone in playtesting that I know of. This wouldn't actually solve the problem.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:06 pm

Alright, maybe if someone could give an actual explanation, instead of just assuming I know what you know. If "just making it up" itself in 1 talent is overpowered, then why is "just making it up, AND augmenting" in 1 talent not overpowered?
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:07 pm

The magical answer is that they're both overpowered bronymous. That's why we're adding the pre-req.

Be patient, we're taking a bit of time to try to make a draft of the clarified new versions. Once it's ready, we'll show it.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Hayatecooper on Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:13 pm

LoganAura wrote:First tier: Basically? Think small. You won't be able to blast that big enemy with a "Turn into a kitty" Spell even with a cmc +100, but you can make the floor slippery to help escape, or give a pony a beard.

Second Tier: Think BIG. Now you can turn the eldritch abomination into a foal, or trace the big bad's scrying on you- just so long as you roll high enough.

Now who on earth would turn an innocent Eldricth Abomination into a foal? That would be just cruel... *whistles*

So tier one is basically anything you could conceivably do with a normal utility talent or less And tier two is everything else.

If I'm reading it right.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  thematthew on Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:17 pm

I think tier 1 is less than you could do with a normal utility talent, since it's anything you can think of at all and are able to roll well enough for (let's be honest, normal utility talents can do anything from ruin farmland to scare small bunnies into sitting still though) as well as make your other talents more magically delicious, and tier 2 is no limits to your imagination.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Hayatecooper on Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:23 pm

I guess.

Whatever happens Big or Small is going to come down to the PH's personal opinion not the player unless you give a small list of stuff you're allowed to do for the first and just go *Shrug* whatever on the second.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  thematthew on Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:25 pm

Indeed. It is nice, though, to have leeway for the GM to decide what is minor in their own campaign, thus why I am in favor.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Hayatecooper on Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:28 pm

It is nice, but I feel it's going to cause Arguments at times. Especially if you have a PH who doesn't really know how they themselves want it to work. But I suppose you're going to get that whatever you try and do, and this looks kinda nice at least.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Ramsus on Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:57 am

We could also modify Bronymous' idea so that we have the spell boosting/modification as the first tree in the talent and the other half of IW as the second. That would prevent the strong part from being taken just as one utility and still would provide more clarity of what each talent is giving for those who weren't satisfied with "minor".
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:24 am

You say "modify", but I'm pretty sure that's exactly what I was proposing.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:40 am

As expected, we've changed the rules so that saving throw penalties don't stack. Playtesting determined that dropping multiple penalties on the same creature was broken and could easily prevent fun.

Save Ends - At the end of your turn, you must attempt a saving throw against all effects on you that say “save ends”. You roll for each effect individually unless the effect says otherwise. If you get a 10 or higher, the effect goes away. If not, you’ll have to try again next turn or wait until someone gives you a saving throw. Some abilities can cause creatures to suffer penalties to saving throws. Penalties to saving throws don’t stack. If you are suffering a -3 penalty to saving throws and another source causes you to suffer a -5 penalty to saving throws, you suffer only the highest penalty - meaning that you will now be suffering a -5 penalty to saving throws. This means that if if you already had a -5 penalty and now a new source causes you to suffer a -3 penalty, there will be no effect.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Hayatecooper on Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:13 am

I thought they already didn't stack... or at least that's what you told me the other day when I figured out how to drop -10/11 on a single creature.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:14 am

They already didn't. We just hadn't announced it officially yet, it was just part of the playtesting. It's sometimes hard to remember what we've officially announced and what we've just told to our supervised playtest groups. =)
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Hayatecooper on Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:23 am

Oh, fair enough.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:13 pm

Posting here cuz following this thread seems like a good idea to me.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:29 pm

A very good idea. This is the most important thread to subscribe to in the forum. Also, fun fact, you can actually subscribe to a thread even without posting in it.

Speaking of this being an important thread to subscribe to... There are now changes to *every single pony race* to match the eight point system! For those living legends fans out there, an eight point update will be coming to you soon too.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:33 pm

Yeah, I know I didn't have to post to subscribe. Just felt like doing so.

Wish I had noticed this thread before...
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:04 pm

Thematthew and Ramsus pointed out that Where it Hurts should be an interrupt utility and they're absolutely correct. Here's the altered talent.

[-2] Where it Hurts – Interrupt Utility
Trigger - You attack an enemy suffering from a (save-ends) effect.
Effect - The triggering attack deals 1d12 extra damage to that enemy. You may use this talent only once per turn.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:43 pm

Ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff-what?! Why would you do that? You couldn't leave it as either a once per turn attack or an "as much as possible" interrupt? It has to be both a Utility and Once Per Turn? That cuts 3 whole d12s off my combo, instead of just 1 or 2.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

Post  thematthew on Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:48 pm

Actually, it doesn't Brony. As a Free Attack it could only be used once per turn, and as it didn't actually hit the target (it made the triggering attack do an extra 1d12 damage) it didn't get anything out of meditate.
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Re: Official Errata: Changes and fixes to the game (Subscription Recommended)

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