Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:34 pm

I would contest that you can make such a build at level 1 in preparation for the unlimited LR, especially if there was a 1/Round LR you could get at 1
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Ramsus on Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:37 pm

???

Are you suggesting we have both my suggested traits and the 5000 gold armor which basically just replaces them entirely? (Though at that point I have no idea why anyone would ever both picking up the second trait as by the point you could do so you could just get the armor.)
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Mon Jul 08, 2013 11:45 pm

Wow, I missed the fact that there was another comment here.
No, I'm suggesting we not split reactions/interrupts into separate traits, (because not 1/round they'd be OP, and 1/Round they'd be UP, so there isn't really a point) and just have a 1/Round Lightning Reflexes as a trait, and a 5000 Gold armor which IS the old LR, but could stack with the 1/Round trait.

Just the following:

Lightning Reflexes
Once per round, you may use a Reaction or Interrupt combat talent not granted from a trait or item for 1 less pip. This cannot reduce its cost to less than 1.

Ninja Cloak - 5000 Gold
Reaction and Interrupt combat talents not granted from traits or items cost 1 less PiP for you to use. This cannot reduce their costs to less than 1.

So, you can make a reaction build at level 1 with the 1/Round LR, then swap it out for the armor ASAP, and then pick the trait back up once you can get it, if you want.

Also, we do need a name. I saw "Quicksilver Armor," but that's a little odd considering we have "Mercury Armor." However, "Ninja Cloak" is still awkward, I think, or at least not epic sounding enough for a 5k item. Maybe I'm wrong?
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  ZamuelNow on Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:17 am

Kindulas wrote:"Ninja Cloak" is still awkward, I think, or at least not epic sounding enough for a 5k item. Maybe I'm wrong?

I think it sounds suitably epic. Besides, a cloak sounds like something speedy and lightweight while an "armor" sounds slower and heavy. That's just me though.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Philadelphus on Tue Jul 09, 2013 1:56 am

Kindulas wrote:Wow, I missed the fact that there was another comment here.
No, I'm suggesting we not split reactions/interrupts into separate traits, (because not 1/round they'd be OP, and 1/Round they'd be UP, so there isn't really a point) and just have a 1/Round Lightning Reflexes as a trait, and a 5000 Gold armor which IS the old LR, but could stack with the 1/Round trait.
So just to be clear, the armor and the trait would stack to reduce the cost of interrupts and reactions not gained from items by 2 PiPs instead of 1 (not reducing them below -1, of course)? That sounds suitably impressive.

Ninja Cloak isn't a bad name either, although maybe "Ninja Cowl" would work better? Since a big flappy cloak seems like it would impede your motion rather than helping it (and yes I know it's just a flavor name and you can reflavor it anyway you want and all that). Robes of Mobility? Enchanted Cloth Armor? Armor of Alacrity?

(Also for those like me who were confused about the Mercury Armor, it's an item in the tabletop version.)

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Ramsus on Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:23 am

Is there some reason the new version of Lightning Reflexes can't reduce things to 0? It's only 1/Round anyway.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:31 am

Philadelphus wrote:
Kindulas wrote:Wow, I missed the fact that there was another comment here.
No, I'm suggesting we not split reactions/interrupts into separate traits, (because not 1/round they'd be OP, and 1/Round they'd be UP, so there isn't really a point) and just have a 1/Round Lightning Reflexes as a trait, and a 5000 Gold armor which IS the old LR, but could stack with the 1/Round trait.
So just to be clear, the armor and the trait would stack to reduce the cost of interrupts and reactions not gained from items by 2 PiPs instead of 1 (not reducing them below -1, of course)? That sounds suitably impressive.

Ninja Cloak isn't a bad name either, although maybe "Ninja Cowl" would work better? Since a big flappy cloak seems like it would impede your motion rather than helping it (and yes I know it's just a flavor name and you can reflavor it anyway you want and all that). Robes of Mobility? Enchanted Cloth Armor? Armor of Alacrity?

(Also for those like me who were confused about the Mercury Armor, it's an item in the tabletop version.)
Indeed! Having both would give you always a -1 reduction, and once per round pull one off at a -2 discount.
And I like Ninja Cowl, actually.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 3:49 am

Ramsus wrote:Is there some reason the new version of Lightning Reflexes can't reduce things to 0? It's only 1/Round anyway.
Hey... that's a good point! At 5 pips over 5 rounds, the 1/Round version was slightly underpowered, but allowing it to bring things down to 0 since it can't actually create the limitless spam scenario, it's fine, and gives LR something with which to actually be cool, rather than just a lame "Ninja Cowl"
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Philadelphus on Tue Jul 09, 2013 5:29 am

Oh, so if you had both the trait and the armor you could, once per round, pull off a [-2] interrupt or reaction for free? That'd be really cool. I don't think it'd be too powerful since you can already trigger a [-2] move every turn at level 2 anyway by getting the trait and the trinket that each give you one PiP.

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:20 pm

No, it should be balanced.
Now we just need to think up more name possibilities
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:26 pm

Cloak of Living Lightning

Lightning Cowl

Shroud of Shadows

Shadow of the Ninja

Assassin's Shroud

Greased Lightning

Armor of Ultimate Reflexes

Assassin's Armor

Armor of Unthinkable Speed

Sash of Supernatural Speed

Haste Box (batteries sold separately)

And more!

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Paper Shadow on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:28 pm

Gotta Go Fast Shirt?

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:29 pm

Win.

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Ramsus on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:40 pm

I liked Ninja Cowl personally.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Xel Unknown on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:48 pm

Yeah, I equally don't see what's wrong with "Ninja Cowl" either. I mean don't you all know that adding Ninja's is instant awesome?
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:50 pm

I like some variation of Ninja Cowl as well.

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:51 pm

*nods* I like ninja cowl, but I wanted to see if there was something better... perhaps it could work for something else, because personally I like Lightning Cowl, because it sounds pretty good and is a nod to the item's origin - I really like the idea of using "lightning" in there. Though "Gotta Go Fast Shirt" is hilarious. Someone needs to take Mercury Armor in the board system and call it that... (it doubles movement)
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:54 pm

I was thinking of some item like the Hideaway cloak but that triggers on rolling initiative, so you can zip out until your first turn. Perhaps that could be the Ninja Cowl?
Edit: Like the Dimensional Cape
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:34 pm

Something like

Ninja Cowl - 1500 Gold
Armor
You may use the following combat talent
[0] Into Darkness - Reaction Utility
Trigger - You roll initiative
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear and target creature gains vulnerability 3 to your next attack.
3 damage is about half an action, and this is 500 Gold more than the minor action cloak - there are both advantages and disadvantages to this version’s trigger


Ninja Cowl - 2000 Gold
Armor
You may use the following combat talent
[0] Into Darkness - Reaction Utility
Trigger - You roll initiative
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear anywhere within 6 spaces of the space you left, and you gain combat advantage on your next attack.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Xel Unknown on Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:09 pm

It's a nice idea... But I'm not so sure you gain so much to make giving up your first turn in combat...
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:10 pm

Xel Unknown wrote:It's a nice idea... But I'm not so sure you gain so much to make giving up your first turn in combat...
You don't, it's just no one can hurt you until your first turn.
If you lost a turn, yeah, it would be horrible.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Xel Unknown on Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:20 pm

Kindulas wrote:Something like

Ninja Cowl - 1500 Gold
Armor
You may use the following combat talent
[0] Into Darkness - Reaction Utility
Trigger - You roll initiative
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear and target creature gains vulnerability 3 to your next attack.
3 damage is about half an action, and this is 500 Gold more than the minor action cloak - there are both advantages and disadvantages to this version’s trigger


Ninja Cowl - 2000 Gold
Armor
You may use the following combat talent
[0] Into Darkness - Reaction Utility
Trigger - You roll initiative
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear anywhere within 6 spaces of the space you left, and you gain combat advantage on your next attack.
I've bolded the imporant parts... Becuase this triggeres basically before anyone's turn happens. YOU LOSE TURN ONE... For the gain of being un-damageable until the start of your turn two and getting some minor power bonus to one attack. (in the board system you get some movement and a minor attack boost) Sure it fits the theme of ninja-ness... But still either you got a bigger bonus to attack or something to make it better. Because the fact that you are giving up your first turn is a very big drawback of this.
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:35 pm

Nonono, you activate this ability before your first turn, your "next turn" thus refers to your first turn
I'll just replace the word "next" with "first" to stem confusion
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Kindulas on Tue Jul 09, 2013 11:49 pm

But anyway, the important thing is implementing the LR fix. Is everyone good with using Lightning Cowl for this and Ninja Cowl later?
Or "Lightning" something else
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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Tue Jul 09, 2013 11:50 pm

We can change names later, let's fix the broken.

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Re: Possible Lightning Reflexes fix

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