Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Crystalite on Thu Dec 26, 2013 7:09 pm

A few traits I would like to see, mainly aimed at Companions; although I could see a player character taking these. Obviously they will need buffing/polishing.

Spoiler:
Tiny (1)
Your size is considered small.

Huge (1)
Your size is considered large.

For that matter, I think some clarifactions regarding size in general within the rulebooks might be in order.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Crystalite on Sat May 10, 2014 11:55 am

Minor thing I noticed:

Call Out (2) – At Will
You let out a loud call. You make make it clear whether or not your call is meant as a warning, distress call, etc. Choose one:

Cheerilee Derp
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Philadelphus on Sat May 10, 2014 9:47 pm

Ah, thanks. Fixed and slightly edited for clarity and sentence flow.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:04 am

Not sure if this is intentional, but Mistral Robes only has a Board version, and not a Skype version counterpart.
Mistral Robes - 1000 Gold
Armor
One per battle, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Mistwalk - Interrupt Utility [1/Battle]
Trigger - A creature targets you with an attack
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the end of this turn. You have line of sight and line of effect to no creature, and no creature has line of sight or line of effect to you. At the end of this turn, you reappear in the space of your choice within 3 spaces of the space you left.

I thought it was wierd, because Dimensional Cape has a similar effect, but has both Skype and Board versions.
Dimensional Cape - 1000 Gold
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.

[0] Hideaway - Minor Utility [1/Battle]
You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear.
Dimensional Cape - 1500 Gold
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.

[0] Hideaway - Minor Utility [1/Battle]
You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. You have line of sight and line of effect to no creature, and no creature has line of sight or line of effect to you. At the start of your next turn, you reappear in the space of your choice within 3 spaces of the space you left.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:28 am

Not everything in the board system can be done in the skype system... This is one of them... Cause it's a reaction intended to avoid damage when it could hit enemies... I mean if it was given into the skype system it'd basically be an armor that can let you avoid damage from any attack once per battle... Which would be insanely powerful even for the madness we already got.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:33 am

Which is exactly what it is in the Board system. There's no difference between the Dimensional capes, except that one lets you move 3 spaces, whereas the other has no spaces to move. And Dimensional Cape and Mistral Robes only differ in that one is an interrupt, and one is a preemptive action. Logically, in Skype there would be a Mistral Robes that omits the "move 3 spaces" clause.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Mon Jun 09, 2014 2:36 pm

Could Daredevil's Rush be turned into an Attack instead of an Utility move? Cause I think this one little change could help turn it into something useable...
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Jun 09, 2014 4:13 pm

How so? What exactly did you have in mind?

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Mon Jun 09, 2014 4:55 pm

Well by itself the move is basically the worst of the system cause if you do it at 1 pip you are basically doing a weaker and worse version of Supercharge without a coin-flip to get a d10 roll... at 2 pips then you're basically doing a worse version of Critfisher's +3 option for only d8, with the added dislike of the self-damage and daze... 3 pips... Still not not so good cause your only getting more damage for less returns... Same with 4 or 5... But you could try to combo it with Guarded Stance with an Interrupt/Reaction Based Build and Iron Will to help try and midagate the daze effects... But even then... I notice it can't be comboed with Guardian's Shield because it's an Utility...

Hell the more I look over it... the only ways it's can be useful is if you already got some way to cut the self-damage to yourself... Or something. Why does it have daze... It keeps striking me as high risk with all the reward removed from it. At it's theoretical best you get five d8 crits & 5 pips... But if that happens you've basically one-hit KOed yourself... I basically wanted and was thinking of trying to use it as an alternate choice to Grab For Power (+6 move to lose 1d8 pips... So kinda would like an option where I don't need to worry about possible pip loss for a crit.) with an Interrupt/Reaction Build when I get to level 3 where I've got Iron Will (save throw for all dazes/stuns, +2 to saves, & get a roll for Daze/Stun at start of turn free) and some Resist from Stwards (resist 3 & -3 to damage)

It used to be neat when you got the power to half it when you rolled an 8... And didn't have real limits on how many pips to gain. Hell if it was an Attack Blinding and Weakening help to give it less of a risk...
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Philadelphus on Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:04 am

Bronymous wrote:Not sure if this is intentional, but Mistral Robes only has a Board version, and not a Skype version counterpart.
Spoiler:

Mistral Robes - 1000 Gold
Armor
One per battle, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Mistwalk - Interrupt Utility [1/Battle]
Trigger - A creature targets you with an attack
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the end of this turn. You have line of sight and line of effect to no creature, and no creature has line of sight or line of effect to you. At the end of this turn, you reappear in the space of your choice within 3 spaces of the space you left.

I thought it was wierd, because Dimensional Cape has a similar effect, but has both Skype and Board versions.
Spoiler:

Dimensional Cape - 1000 Gold
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.

[0] Hideaway - Minor Utility [1/Battle]
You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear.
Spoiler:

Dimensional Cape - 1500 Gold
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.

[0] Hideaway - Minor Utility [1/Battle]
You cease to exist and can take no actions until the start of your next turn. You have line of sight and line of effect to no creature, and no creature has line of sight or line of effect to you. At the start of your next turn, you reappear in the space of your choice within 3 spaces of the space you left.
I don't see why there couldn't be a Skype version. Something like the following, perhaps (I'm not sure I can see it going for less than a thousand gold):

Mistral Robes - 1000 Gold
Armor
One per battle, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Mistwalk - Interrupt Utility [1/Battle]
Trigger - A creature targets you with an attack
Effect - You cease to exist and can take no actions until the end of this turn. While in this state of nonexistence, you can affect no creature and no creature can affect you in any way. At the start of your next turn, you reappear.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:53 pm

Daredevil's Rush really needs some major buffing... Cause any X-pip move should be in theory viable at any value you use for X... (I believe all of the -X pip moves are always useful no matter how much pips you pump into them) Which for Daredevil is only getting a pip gain of 1 to 5... Which as I pointed out most of them 1 & 2 pip gain is just a weaker and worse versions of the two +3 moves Supercharge & Critfisher. And because of that even using it at it's 3 pip gain form is only weaker than using Critfisher at +3 (because Critfisher doesn't have 3d8 self damage, which is totally worth it to only get less dice rolled, and you also get the power to roll d10s or d12s if you wish...) or supercharge (again you get +3 pips and only have to worry about 1d8 damage along with getting a 50% chance of getting a d10 attack roll too. Also it's an attack meaning weakening & blinding combo with it in HELPFUL ways, something you only get out of those status effects with only Supercharge) So the move is only worthwhile pip gain wise at 4 or 5... Which still... You're getting nearly possible one-hit-KO self-damage... Which even if you wanta combo that with Iron Shield... It's still getting you to really dange low HP making it likely to either lose the pips. Or just getting KOed, which is equally bad even if you can still keep the pips.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:06 pm

Xel Unknown wrote:Daredevil's Rush really needs some major buffing... Cause any X-pip move should be in theory viable at any value you use for X...

Daredevil's Rush was designed to be a goofy power that people could try to find ways to play with, but was certain not to break the game. Some people like trying to turn trash into treasure, preferably unique trash, and find ways to make the supposedly unworkable work. That's why cards like One With Nothing exist in Magic the Gathering. They serve a narrow but meaningful portion of the playerbase. In fact, one of my players refused to play with any build considered even close to optimal. He'd make a beeline for anything that everyone thought was terrible in the system and had a lot of fun playing the unique underdog.

Lots of powers already exist that are good to use, or are just plain OP, in the current system. Very few exist for this portion of the player base, so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to cut one of this group's few toys to add yet another toy to an existing group that already has a lot. Especially when a +X power can be so potentially dangerous in creating OP characters (and broke tons of things when it was a viable option in combat builds) and throw off encounter planning.

It's worth noting that Wanderlust (the new system) is being designed differently than the current system. It's being designed without much worry for different kinds of optimization, making sure everything is equally viable and as fun to *play* as possible, with character-building being about doing flavorful and cool stuff more than min/maxing in lots of different ways. So you'll be seeing things be a lot more mathematically balanced and everything being viable in the new system (though I expect some things will look so awesome that it'll be hard to believe they're fair at first). So if you see a move in the new system, it'll be there because it's viable.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:27 pm

Well still think that as it is, it's not even "trash move" to try and turn into something useful but an anti-move that is unhelpful and only wishes to waste your time trying to find some way to make it work as it is... It's only at it's best if you can find a way to work with it at it's +5 mode... Cause you're wasting too much to try and figure out how to get any of the other other pip gain settings to work at all. Maybe if it somehow allowed like some degree of the self-damage to also damage one or more enemies it could be at least possible to build something with it. And then we'd get another neat damage dealing utility (we got at least two of those last I checked each with a drawback, one has it's damage be delayed a turn before it happens, the other has a 50% chance of not dealing damage, hell still not seeing the logic behind having it have the daze side effect) move which would be a plus in my mind. Don't think that just becuase you wanta move to a new system and focus mostly on that you should then therefore automatically ignore any suggestions to help improve the old system a little.

Also on another note could Caltraps be upgraded from 1d4 damage to 1d4 loss of life? Cause that's another really weak move that could use a minor buff like that to make it a lot more useful. (cause if you got an enemy with resist of any type... the move get's automatically a lot weaker till you get to 100% useless if they got resist 4 or more)
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:35 pm

An anti-move as you define it is the definition of a trash move. Again, see One With Nothing in MTG (it's a spell that does nothing but force you to discard your whole hand with no upside whatsoever).

I'll be happy to take suggestions on the old system, but patching the old system isn't high on my list of priorities. If I had infinite time, I'd definitely love to keep working on it as much as possible - but every hour I spend patching the old is an hour I don't spend trying to work out the new. It's a shame, but it's just the reality of the situation. Wanderlust needs a lot of attention, as do other projects I'm committed to. Of course, just because I don't usually have time to work on the old system doesn't mean others won't either. Philadelphus still pays attention to it, for example.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:59 pm

No... I'm saying Daredevil's Rush is like a card that makes you SET REAL FIRE TO YOUR DECK... For no reason... And failure to do so is an autolose the game. It is basically that bad of a move in my opinion, and I don't think it should be that bad. I have nothing against a move that is more harm then good... But I'm trying to point out that Daredevil's Rush goes so far in that way. To the point that that I challenge anyone to try and make a combat build with that move being a focal point and I'll find a way to improve it by replacement of the Daredevil's move...

Pros: d8 Crit chance & pip gain...

Cons: Self-damage that gets stronger the more pips you wish to gain which can get to ONE HIT KO LEVELS OF DAMAGE if you wish to gain 4 or 5 pips (which is basically the only way to get nearly anything out of the move) & one round self-daze...

Also it's name, bugs me cause it only does self-damage which is kinda why I think it should also do some enemy damage to some degree. Equally don't understand why when you remove it's "cut damage in half at crit" effect you then added on dazing as well...
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:02 pm

Xel Unknown wrote:No... I'm saying Daredevil's Rush is like a card that makes you SET REAL FIRE TO YOUR DECK... For no reason...

Which makes it better than One With Nothing in MTG, as you can at least get energy out of it.

The power is designed for a specific subset of players that you clearly don't fall into. There are likewise lots of powers that you probably enjoy which those players would never use. The power is fulfilling its intended purpose right now. Not every power is designed for every player.


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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:36 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:
It's worth noting that Wanderlust (the new system) is being designed differently than the current system. It's being designed without much worry for different kinds of optimization, making sure everything is equally viable and as fun to *play* as possible, with character-building being about doing flavorful and cool stuff more than min/maxing in lots of different ways. So you'll be seeing things be a lot more mathematically balanced and everything being viable in the new system (though I expect some things will look so awesome that it'll be hard to believe they're fair at first). So if you see a move in the new system, it'll be there because it's viable.

That's exactly what you said about the old system. ALL of the old versions had that tagline- everything is more "balanced", all possibilities are as fun to play as others, its about doing cool flavorful things instead of minmaxing. But every change and new iteration of the system has been bi-polar on all of those points- boosting minmaxing for some builds while cutting it for others, questionable math across the board when it comes to balance, and even the open-ended Abilities system made character creation more restrictive in some cases.

If the flavor is as open to change in the new one as this one, then changing the mechanics should mean nothing to how cool or flavorful things could be, plain and simple- the only thing cutting that down now is DM stipulation. Balance is a fairy tale in this system, so I should hope that everything is made more even (since it was my favorite stuff that cut down while the other stuff got built up).

Honestly I would love to see Races come back. Races gave needed structure to the game, allowed the DM to not have to micromanage his game so much when looking at what the players want vs what he wants, and what should be acceptable.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:46 pm

You know, the biggest problem I started out with the dang move is the fact that it being a Utility makes it cut off from a lot of stuff that can help it. (hell if "Sorry Didn't See you there" also worked on self-damage that trait could help improve the move with a coin flip to gain 2 more pips when you deal 5+ damage to yourself) The Friendly Fire trait (5 resist to self and allies for your attacks) and the Guardian's Shield Move (-2 Interrupt to cut an attack's damage in half) could both make the move feel more viable if they were usable with the move, which thanks to being a utility they can't. Also... STILL, kinda asking for the logic behind the adding daze to that move, cause I'd love to see the maths or whatever if you can recall that. The daze side effect is kinda majorly bugging me as what's really just pushing the move too far into the "literally burning your own deck of cards to ash" level of self-harm. Really seemed like a kick to the groin when you did the change, still does...

---

And if that topic is basically one you don't wish to hear anything more from me nor answer my questions, let's move on to the Caltraps minor change from damage to loss of life... Cause while it might help make an enemy avoid hitting you, odds are you the player isn't going to really know that fact for sure. So it might not even feel like it did anything. But if it had loss of life instead of damage, it'd feel powerful enough to make you feel like you're protecting yourself if you don't get harmed after using the move. I mean, if you are fighting any enemies with resist 4 (or even any resist at all)... You'll easily feel like you are wasting a minor and throwing away a pip... Which form the games I've played you can find out if you doing nothing in terms of damage to the enemy. So overall turning it into loss of life wont improve it's power that much, but just make sure it's always to some degree of useful.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:56 pm

@Bronymous - The old system was absolutely bi-polar in its desires to be simultaneously balanced and fun to min/max in, with some combinations made to intentionally be over the curve but without strict numbers on how much we should allow in which cases. We also had a huge tendency to throw things in because we could, not because they were necessarily fun to actually play with or because they served some sort of character concept. The new system has been built from the ground-up to be balanced with hard and fast numbers and no desire to enable optimized combos. I have a hunch they won't all "look" balanced, but the math checks out so far - and we'll be making it easily available.

Races aren't coming back though, because they serve no meaningful role in the game. They're strangling in settings where races are *not* equal in power (trying to cram a super-powerful race into 8 points and simultaneously justify an inherently weaker race to have just as many points creates many unnecessary design and development issues) and the ability system allows for all the flexibility required to represent your character - without the need to dip into genetic engineering in order to remove the 'flight' ability from your character if you're playing a flightless pegasus or something. It also makes it harder to port things across settings. Abilities and powers represent what your character can do, no specific 'race' or 'class' is needed for the system's design goal. A selection of suggested templates for races is likely to come out at some point though, to give DMs structure if they so desire. I believe Philadelphus has one for the current system already.

We've gone over the race issue a million times already, and we definitely aren't bringing them back. There's simply no reason that supports our system's design goals.


@XelUnknown - I think Caltrops definitely doesn't feel good enough right now to warrant using, and you can often feel like it didn't do anything. I agree. However, I don't think changing it to loss of life would solve that issue - because I feel the issue comes from spending energy to subtly encourage the enemy to attack someone else... Which either isn't enough of a deterrent because the numbers are so small or feels like a waste because you spent energy to prevent monsters from attacking you when they might already be going after someone else.

Any suggestions?


EDIT - As for the Daze question, it was originally to prevent various combos that were far too powerful (there was a time when all the best builds were abusing Daredevil's Rush). However, I honestly can't remember what they were. The change was made a long while ago and honestly we might have fixed those issues in any case elsewhere - leaving the daze to make the move feel a bit more flavorful and look even worse balance-wise. A safety valve to make sure it didn't break things again and looked even more appealing (by being seriously bad) to its target players. But I don't have notes on this or anything, and Daredevil's rush went through so many changes I can't remember them all from over a year ago.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:08 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:The new system has been built from the ground-up to be balanced with hard and fast numbers and no desire to enable optimized combos.
But we like combos... seriously combination is the most fun part of combat, unless you're playing an underdog, no skill character with a random assortment of goodies to play around with (I am, it's neat). Are you taking out combinations altogether, or just one turn move strings, or just nerfing all of it or what?

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:They're strangling in settings where races are *not* equal in power (trying to cram a super-powerful race into 8 points and simultaneously justify an inherently weaker race to have just as many points creates many unnecessary design and development issues) and the ability system allows for all the flexibility required to represent your character
Illustrating the Bi-Polarity with that one. You want something that can illustrate one race being better than another, by throwing out the mechanic that DID make one race potentially better than another, and funneling all the mechanics into a catchall that puts everyone, regardless of race at an even level of effectivity. Not that one race should obviously over-power the rest, but some races are and should be represented as being better at things than others, if not downright incapable of some abilities, and racial templates do that without causing headaches and conflict between DMs and Players.

I understand its not coming back, I'm not pushing for it, but this is the same weird duality that's made every update to this game hard to swallow. It makes it seem like the fault is in the logic, like you guys don't know what you're really going for here. Attempting to appeal to everyone, but failing to really satisfy anyone.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Xel Unknown on Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:11 pm

Maybe have it be where you are either shielding yourself and an ally with like a 2d6 loss of life reaction... Or throwing them around an enemy for a weaker effect of like 2d4 loss of life... I still strongly feel that Caltraps would work great having it work with loss of life given what caltraps do.
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:25 pm

Bronymous wrote:But we like combos... seriously combination is the most fun part of combat, unless you're playing an underdog, no skill character with a random assortment of goodies to play around with (I am, it's neat). Are you taking out combinations altogether, or just one turn move strings, or just nerfing all of it or what?

You can't simultaneously have builds be balanced to nearly-equal power to one another and have combinations that offer significant power boosts above what most builds can do without them. Those are two opposite things.

There are still combinations that are fun to put together in the new system, and I've already seen evidence of stress testers be absolutely sure that various combinations are extraordinarily powerful because of how they look together (and certain tricks that let things look more powerful than they are), but the numerical end results are completely balanced. At least, that's what we're going for. The Monk draft posted in the new system announcement thread is a good example of a combo-style that offers coolness but not OPness.

It's absolutely true though that the new system is not going to be designed for people that enjoy exploiting systems to build OP characters. Character-building for flavor reasons and for gameplay reasons should be lots of fun, and things should be *way* more balanced. but we're not trying to cater to everyone at once anymore (which led to the bi-polar stuff you talked about). Good gameplay and the support of major flavor concepts are our primary concerns. Character building is seen here as a means to an end (fun in the adventure and representation of a mental concept of a character), not an end in itself.

Bronymous wrote:
Illustrating the Bi-Polarity with that one. You want something that can illustrate one race being better than another, by throwing out the mechanic that DID make one race potentially better than another, and funneling all the mechanics into a catchall that puts everyone, regardless of race at an even level of effectivity. Not that one race should obviously over-power the rest, but some races are and should be represented as being better at things than others, if not downright incapable of some abilities, and racial templates do that without causing headaches and conflict between DMs and Players.

Actually, when you make it so that each race has 8 points worth of stuff - that DOES make all races equal. The abilities system is what allows unequal racial power.

Let's take the example of a DC campaign. Superman is a Kryptonian and the Martian Manhunter is a Martian. Their races are inherently more powerful than vanilla humans. Trying to represent their races with 8 ability points, and justify humans as having an equal amount of racial points, would be ridiculous (I know their races are heavily combat-focused, but just using them for the sake of example).

However, in the ability points system - a character like Batman could say most of his special abilities come from his skills, training and utility belt, while Superman and Martian Manhunter can say their special abilities come from their inherent racial powers. The ability point system gives you the flexibility to play a race that is far more powerful than other races, without creating imbalanced characters.

Trying to say Kryptonians get 8 racial points and Humans get 8 racial points is just silly. It's a huge design hassle to get it even close, it comes with additional problems I haven't even gone into much right now, and it just doesn't make any sense. It's much more sensible to just give players a bunch of points and say, "Pick stuff that represents what your character can do. It's up to you to decide if those powers come from technology, an inherent racial ability, skill, magic, mutant powers or anything else. The flavor is up to you."


Last edited by Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 8:05 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:27 pm

Xel Unknown wrote:Maybe have it be where you are either shielding yourself and an ally with like a 2d6 loss of life reaction... Or throwing them around an enemy for a weaker effect of like 2d4 loss of life... I still strongly feel that Caltraps would work great having it work with loss of life given what caltraps do.

Interesting thoughts. I sadly can't go into them right now, because working on new design is a can of works way bigger than talking about old design decisions (and I'm studying for my final final of all the finals right now). I'd recommend sending the idea to Philadelphus too, so I don't forget about it entirely out of sheer absentmindedness (I do that a lot).

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  A1C Bronymous on Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:08 pm

That's easily the best explained answer I've yet gotten on the topic. But 8 racials to 8 racials, equal as it is, isn't any more equal than 30 ability points vs 30 ability points. It's just another flavoring issue. Does make the bridge that was GE make more sense now (or less, considering).
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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:14 pm

Glad to hear the answer came across well. =)

And you're right, 30 ability points is 30 ability points. The point is to make all characters created equal, even when their races aren't. So if you play a human in a DC universe game, you'll have just as much awesome stuff as the Kryptonian - because the Kryptonian will spend a lot of ability points justifying his race's natural powers, while you'll be able to spend yours on bat-planes and bat-gadgets.

You could theoretically play the worst race ever (0 points worth of stuff) in a game where someone plays a race with a huge amount of natural abilities (30 points worth of stuff) and have both *characters* be balanced, because you spend your 30 ability points on special abilities that don't naturally come from your race (skills, training, gadgets and all that stuff).

This allows us to simultaneously have balanced characters, while still allowing races of varying power to be represented. Players just have to pay for special powers out of their ability points, whether those special powers come from some natural racial advantage or whether it comes from training/tech/anywhere else. If your race has more cool natural abilities, you get fewer extra toys. If your race has few natural abilities, you have more cool toys.

This way there's no power difference between someone saying, "I want to play a Martian, a race that can turn ghostly and fly and change shape" and someone saying, "I want to play a human sorcerer that has the magical powers to turn ghostly, fly and change shape". Where the powers come from is a flavor thing that means a lot for roleplaying, but doesn't interfere with balance. Both players get to be equally powerful, even though one is portraying a more powerful race.

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Re: Official Errata Suggestion/Discussion Thread (changes you'd like to see made)

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