A Brand New System - Official Announcement

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Zarhon on Sat Apr 05, 2014 5:41 pm

1) What's a "Novice Feature"?

2) I assume the trait points are the combat-side of the level up progression?

3) If you get '1 special move' at lvl1, does that imply more later, from other sources?

4) Can legendary/Heroic points (combat and non-combat) buy those of the tier below them? Such as, using a legendary point to buy a heroic one.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Sat Apr 05, 2014 5:44 pm

1) A special kind of combat trait from a select list at level 1.

2) Yep.

3) No, it's just being precise. You only get one special move. More would stop making them so special.

4) We're considering this heavily, but we can't confirm one way or another yet. It depends on several additional factors.

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Zarhon on Sat Apr 05, 2014 5:50 pm

What about point spillover, for the heroic/legendary tiers of stuff? I.e. you're left with an excess 1-2 points (trait or ability) with nothing worthwhile to spend it on, or want to wait some levels to get a costlier ability. Would there be any 'compensation' for such unspent points, akin to how Daniel used 'unspent' talent spec points to give yourself a pseudo-skill boost in his talent spec module?

Also notice a lack of any 'gold' mentioned. Are items now DM-given/crafted rewards, rather than auto-upgrades? Will there be equivalent non-combat /'technique' items in that case as well (or a list/template of them that the DM can use, for examples or DM simplicity)?
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Sat Apr 05, 2014 5:57 pm

That's one of the factors we'll be considering. Our priority will be making sure the system is as pleasant to use and as painless as possible. We just can't come to conclusions until we have a good picture of the specific abilities available and their associated point costs. Since the specific abilities aren't even designed yet, much less developed, we can't comment on this aspect of the system yet.

Gold was actually never an auto-upgrade and was always a DM-only reward. My own games almost never had players with level-appropriate gold. Usually they'd be vastly over or under the norm depending on how things were going for them in the story. However, most people almost always played it as an auto-upgrade so we just decided to go with the flow. DM rewards will now get to be more special in comparison.

It'll also be easy to provide gold and say, "1000 gold is worth 10 points of traits, so if you have 3000 gold you can buy an item that simulates a 30 point trait". Hopefully though, this will encourage DMs to keep their bait for players in terms of story-hooks or truly unique items rather than posting a basic gold reward.

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:43 am

Right... here's my views on this....

*Ahem*

HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:44 am

Penetrating analysis. =)

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:47 am

Your welcome.

Even more penetrating analysis can come later. When its not 5am, and I'm not up to my neck in drama
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Paper Shadow on Mon Apr 07, 2014 1:21 am

Why are you up at 5am anyway Fury?

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:52 am

Paper Shadow wrote:Why are you up at 5am anyway Fury?

Trying to resolve said friend drama.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:16 pm

Okay. First thing first, I have to express my desire to help the development of this new system, in order to help it along. I know I’m not a play-tester, but I’m pretty sure I can get a good grasp of any maths/mechanics you create... I know its unlikely, but I gotta state my desire to help.

1. No Max Life. This is quite simply great for healing builds and talents in general. Before, you always had to worry about not wasting your healing, so you normally waited until people were around 20 health to use something like healing salve. Now however, you can use your healing whenever you want to, and have no fear of wasting it. Makes dedicated supports much stronger. Works well with tanks as well, as it makes regeneration even more useful as it can take you over your normal health.

2. Techniques. Hoy boy, do these excite me GREATLY! I’ve understood why combat and noncombat were kept apart from one another, but I’ve always had flavour issues with it, and it had limited the options available. If I’m reading it right, techniques will cost both a combat talent and a utility talent, so to speak, so it doesn’t give you more options than other people. Am I right?

3. Trait’s using a point-buy system. I honestly like this, as it gives you a much greater flexibility and balance ability to the system. Just like how the utility talents and racial talents were merged together into the point-buy ability system. Still, it would of been nice to get one or two ‘novice trait points’ at level one, just to open things up a bit more.

4. Finally. Just. Finally. I’ll be able to create my own campaigns...

5. Destiny Combat Talents. I like this idea. Yes, its been a cause of concern in that it might encouraging min-maxing, but I’m pretty sure that you’ll be able to balance it so that the min-maxing is limited. More importantly, it’ll make all the destinies rather fresh and exciting. Dynamic Duo for example, has always felt flat to me, but having talents in combat as well? That might actually make me wanna grab it. That being said, I’ll probably stick to self-discovery mainly, especially if it borrows combat talents from the other destinies like it does for features.

6. Tiers. I have to put my full support behind this. Recently I’ve had a character that has a heavy focus on perception. He’s got a +15 on it, and has a eagle-eye, sharp eyes, empathetic, and Nightwatch. In other words, his perception is maxed out, and there isn’t anyway for it to evolve. Having his abilities limited to some degree, and having more methods of them being able to grow, would be great. Plus, it works with combat traits, allowing better scaling for them as well.

7. Injures. Quite simply, this is a great idea. Making it much easier for DM’s to construct environments in which can hinder the party if they mess up. Hell, using it as a template, having environmental effects in battle, as well as having encounters that mix combat with non-combat will most likely be much easier.

8&9. What else can I say, but so eager for them to come about! I do wonder if the combat overhaul will be compatible with the original Ponytales system through. You know, for those that prefer the old system, but like the new combat.

11. Fatal Damage. Losing all your Pips when you went out cold was annoying, but made sense. As well as the no-lethality, due to being focused on FiM... but this opens up a more organic sense to combat. Not only can you die, but its possible to kill the enemy... perhaps even by accident. Just imagine the roleplay potential if THAT happens!
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:35 pm

Great to hear. Glad the changes look exciting. They're a lot of fun to work on.

Did you see the others spoiled in the rest of the thread yet?

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:57 pm

Skills and leveling system? Yeah I've seem them. The skills look solid. I admit, I'm worried a bit about general knowledge, but with it and freaky knowledge... we should be fine when it comes to knowledge.

The defensive and optional social skills are good as well. Reminds me a lot of D&D I admit. With the D&D saves, and Diplomacy, Bluff and Intimidate for the social skills. As for the leveing system? Not really much I can say about that.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  ZamuelNow on Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:40 pm

Fury of the Tempest wrote:6. Tiers. I have to put my full support behind this. Recently I’ve had a character that has a heavy focus on perception. He’s got a +15 on it, and has a eagle-eye, sharp eyes, empathetic, and Nightwatch. In other words, his perception is maxed out, and there isn’t anyway for it to evolve. Having his abilities limited to some degree, and having more methods of them being able to grow, would be great.

It could be argued that tiers might not do much for this. Depending on how things are divvied up, the collection of abilities might still be available at level one. Building styles may be an interesting thing pending on how this goes.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:42 pm

Indeed. Tiers are going to be specifically designed to spread out upgrades like this though, so you can't max out a major concept at novice tier. Maybe a minor concept though.

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:42 pm

Its just an example through.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Dusk Raven on Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:53 pm

How did I miss the No Max HP thing? Not sure how I feel about that. Given the nature of HP in this system, it makes sense, though.

So I guess this'll be like 2nd Edition of Pony Tales/Living Legends? Razz
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  ZamuelNow on Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:01 pm

I dunno. Abilities sorta makes this change feel more like a 3rd edition.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:06 pm

Indeed. It's basically a massive leap forward from the originals. If we consider the stuff back when we had racial barriers to utility the first edition... This might be 4th or 5th. Alternatively, you might even consider this to be the first edition, because things never did get out of beta. Or a whole new version. =)

Spoiler combat talent for the new system.

[+4] Spark - Standard Attack
Deal 1 damage to target creature.

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Copper Rose on Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:08 pm

Why did you have to start this discussion the day I left for Washington DC? Now I have 5 pages to read through, and so much of the proposed stuff looks so amazing, and I just may incorporate the Fatal Damage stuff into my already existing campaigns (unless players complain, or just don't like it) and see how stuff works from there.

I don't know if this was talked about later, but how I would probably deal with All Or Nothing is that the drop to -15 damage would be non-Fatal Damage dealing damage, until any more damage was dealt to them. Basically, other players would have until this player is back above 0 HP again, or even 1 damage dealt would result in this player suddenly having 16 FD. Maybe make it so that instead of -1 HP with 1 damage would result in 2 FD instead of 16 FD, but deciding between those would have to be an experimental thing instead of a hypothesizing thing.

I also like the lack of Max HP, and may incorporate that too. In fact, I like the idea of extra health above normal starting health taking away from FD at the end of a combat, so that a player can survive the day by getting a bunch of super heals if they somehow get 24 FD early in the day. For example, if a player is at 34 HP when a combat ends and they have 10 FD, they start the next combat with 30 HP and 6 FD instead of 30 HP and 10 FD.
To add to this concept (though it may be taking it too far), maybe make it so that if you have so much extra HP at the end of a combat that you get negative FD, that negative FD adds to your PiPs for the next Combat. Example: end of combat [44 HP, 12 FD, X PiPs] next combat [30 HP, 0 FD, 6(4+2) PiPs]
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:13 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:Spoiler combat talent for the new system.

[+4] Spark - Standard Attack
Deal 1 damage to target creature.

+4 PiP's is equivalent to 1 damage? I like that. It'll be much easier to build up pips for the big moves from the looks of things, as well as more stragetic options in general due to + PiPs able to do more.

Wonder if they'll be traits that do more if you have more PiPs.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Crystalite on Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:01 pm

I would love to see more X PiP talents too, both plus and minus.
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:27 pm

Spoiler number 2.

[-X] Magic Missiles - Minor Attack
Deal 1d4+1 damage to X target creatures.

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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Dusk Raven on Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:32 pm

I think I'm going to love this combat revamp. Big Smiles, Sweetie 
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Fury of the Tempest on Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:40 pm

Same here. I really like magic missile, as the damage it does is proportional to the amount of PiP's spent. Question is through, can you apply that damage to a creature, twice?
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Re: A Brand New System - Official Announcement

Post  Stairc -Dan Felder on Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:43 pm

I'm loving the revamp too. Can't wait to play in it.

Just like with normal AOEs, you can't target the same creature multiple times. Magic Missile is a cool power because you can scale it to hit X different creatures.

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