Star Wars: The Pony Menace (Setting and Rules Expansion)

This is an idea for a modification/expansion of the Pony Tales rules that I've been brainstorming recently.

I don't have a speech or any particular goals aside from making something that works well both mechanically and as a combination of the Star Wars and MLP universes. To keep things flowing smoothly I'll be saying right now that I'll be the arbiter of what does and doesn't end up as the rules and such for this. That said, it's my intention to end up with rules and modifications that people like. Unless there's some great reason to later, we'll be keeping everything in this one thread to avoid clutter.

As for the name, I'm sure that will change and I'll be happy to hear suggestions, I just needed a name for the thread.

So here are my ideas so far:
I don't see any real need as of yet to change any of the core mechanics of the Pony Tales rule-set to fit. The attributes, skills, and other mechanics will probably work just fine.

It's possible we'll change the level up gains and/or expand the amount of levels to a higher amount.

We'll be changing the name of Magic Points to Force Points (cuz, duh). As such references to magic will be instead references to the force. If anyone has a really good idea for what to rename the Arcana skill we'll probably use it, otherwise we'll just stick with Arcana (what the word means still actually applies to the force, even if it does sound a bit weird).

The first major change is that the force will not be exclusive to Unicorns or other races. This means a lot of Unicorn Utilities are becoming Force Utilities, a new category of Everypony Utilities just to keep things tidy. Mechanically I see no reason to limit anypony from taking Force Utilities whenever they want but, PH's likely will impose their own rules on this unique to each game. Everypony with be treated as having Ponykinesis for the purposes of meeting prerequisites and will gain it when they do. As such Unicorns need some new racial benefit. To be clear, they will still have Ponykinesis as a racial benefit, it just isn't worth nearly as much when everypony else can have it too.

Changelings will gain the option of Favorite Form or my custom version of CopyCat (does the original namer of this now defunct racial power want me to name this something else?) at character creation. I would encourage PHs to allow any Changeling character to re-choose this choice at level up in the same way anypony can re-choose their Utilities. The reasoning for this aside from my just liking it is because of my ideas for Droids that step on their toes a bit.
CopyCat: At character creation you may choose for one of your Utility talents to be from any race's list. Every time you gain a new Utility talent from a level you may choose from any race's list. You may never have more Utility talents from other race's lists than the number of utilities you've gained from leveling up + 1.
Note: Dilettante overrides CopyCat's limitations.

Droids, this is a new race ("race") we'll need to make. I only have a few ideas so far and I look forward to seeing what sort of things people come up with. (And yes I am aware there is a Robot race already but, it really wouldn't work as a common player race.)

-this racial ability needs a name!-: Droids may pick any race's utilities but, they may not pick Force Utilities.

Something that lets them fly but doesn't mean all droids can fly. I'm thinking some sort of a really variable thing, like a choose two or three of the following dozen or so benefits, or something like that. *shrug* Basically something that will acknowledge that droid types are really as wide in variety as races but, doesn't require us making four or five different droid races.

Droids are not effected positively or negatively by poisons, potions, lack of air, etc. They still need sleep (recharging), though we might say they need less of it. They are repaired instead of healed thus, Mechanics is used instead of Heal to cure them of injuries/ailments (by ailments I pretty much mean things like computer viruses). (Obviously needs better wording.)

I think we'll want to make a bunch more races too. Maybe squids, fish, some other kinds of insects/dogs/cats, and obviously....Teddy Bears.

Some of the telekinesis utilities and others might need their usability limits adjusted to fit better in the setting.

Items. We will have them. Lightsabers, blaster, thermal detonators, etc. We'll probably use very different ideas for these than the ones for the Fallout setting as ammo isn't really a major issue most of the time. Having ammo for special things like grenades, missile launchers, etc. is simply enough handled by just treating them like any other consumable item.

Well, that's about all I've got for now.

Warning- random, incoherrant thoughts ahead.

Do all player characters have to be jedi with force powers?- han solo and chewbacca were not jedi, but still important characters in the movies. I would say that at character creation, you can choose an additinal something or the other (maybe a racial trait?) that declares you as a jedi, but the would have to be something to offset that for non-jedi characters.

However, i have just rembered that there are some races in the star was verse whose entire population is force sensitive. Still, the above bears thinking about should someone decide to run a non-jedi pony. Non-jedi pony. Now that is a phrase i never thought i would say. These non-jedi ponies (yup, still saying it, still wierd) would still be able to use some abilities that require magic/force points, because the force is with them regardless of sensitivity, but wouldnt have access to the jedi powers, as flavourwise they would require force-sensitivity, concentration and training to use.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

I absolutely love this idea too. A lot could be accomplished by reflavoring too.

Twitchy Tail could be "Sees things before they happen" for example.

May the Horse be with you.

Well Unicorns are the "our entire race is force sensitives". A no, nopony has to be a jedi. You don't have to choose Force Utilities (which before we make any new ones are mostly just the Unicorn Utilities). I don't think we need something to separate force users from non-force users aside from the PH or the player declaring it to be so but, if other people think we do then I'll go with it.

Ah, er, yeah, I never meant to imply non-force using ponies couldn't use FP. Yes, the force is with them. Also it's a mechanical abstraction that's with them.

(And because this post still felt a bit short.....) What, there are bears above us!? RUN AWAY!

Edit: Blargh! *explodes* I should have seen that pun coming.

I was thinking about vehicle combat today and I ended up deciding that instead of having to craft a whole new system for that, we should just handle it with skills. Possibly a skills challenge sort of situation with people in the right positions (pilot, gunner, etc.) being limited to skills that actually fit with what they can actually do in that position.

Edit: Hmmm, well that's sad. Doesn't seem to be much interest in this so far.

I'd heard (or saw?) this thread before, but I'd been too preoccupied with other stuff to comment on it.

I'm not sure if I like the idea of giving every race access to unicorn magic and just calling it "the Force" (or "the Horse," which would be more punny). I mean, there are still magic users in Star Wars. Think about all the bog witches and such, like the kind they showed in the Clone Wars Saga on Cartoon Network. I think the witches there had some loose connections to the Force, but they also seemed to know a lot about making potions and using more traditional magic too.

I'd say that Unicorns should be able to keep their magical abilities, and if you don't want to call it magic, then call it extra force sensitivity.

I think the best way to make a Jedi option in the Pony Tales setting would be to make a Jedi-specific Destiny. Maybe you could choose some Unicorn talents at some of the destiny advancements?


For spaceship combat, perhaps you could treat it like normal combat where each ship has it's own Hit Points and combat abilities (some of which might even allow them to get further away from their assailants?) and the players on-board have turns to act in-between combat rounds (so, for instance, they could be steering the ship out of harms way, repairing damages, kicking the hyper-jump drive so the bucking thing will activate like it's supposed to, etc.)


As far as weapons go, how about this for a Lightsaber:

Out of Combat:
Can be drawn and activated to produce light in a 10ft radius centered on the weapon. While activated, the weapon can also be used as a kind of welding torch to cut through most materials, given enough time (it would take longer to cut through stainless steel blast doors as opposed to sheet metal, for instance). Generates a soft humming noise that might give away your position in a stealth-oriented mission though.

In-Combat:
The wielder gets the following bonus combat abilities -

[-2] Parry (Interrupt)
Block an attack that was targeting you. The attack does no damage.

[-5] Deflect (Interrupt)
Block a attack that was targeting you that has the "laser" energy type and redirect it back at the attacking enemy. The attack does no damage to you, instead dealing full damage to the attacker.

Edit: Changed up the Lightsaber to fit specs.

Uh....aheh....yeah....um....awkward. If you knew more about expanded universe stuff you'd know there is no "magic". Even if people call it that it's still just the force. It's not the kind of info you'd get from watching (an admittedly good) show aimed at kids though, so I can't fault you for your misunderstanding. The potions and stuff basically fall under "sith alchemy" or "sith sorcery" though that's not really limited to the sith. Other force users do stuff like that too. Just not so much the Jedi. The Jedi are basically the disciplined but, straightforward and thinking inside the box group and other groups end up coloring outside the lines and blindly stumbling around and finding tricks to do with the force that Jedi would often go "huh, what?" at.

If we do what you suggest for combat we end up with bigger ships almost always instantly killing smaller ones. You can't really have you X-wing dodging blasts from a Star Destroyer since the attacks would auto hit and it wouldn't make sense for the Star Destroyer's attacks to do tiny tiny amounts of damage. I know of ways you could make it work but, like I said before....it's ends up needlessly complicated.

I don't think the weapons need to come with attacks. People already get attacks. I wouldn't really want to take away character choices by making all lightsaber users essentially fighter rogues or something instead of having the paladin options or such. Though hmmm. Maybe weapons should always add a few combat moves to the choices the character already has? That'd be a good way for them to have their own flavor but not be incredibly limiting.

Well, lightsabers can also be used to cut things like a really strong cutting torch. We should probably add that to the out of combat thing.

I like Parry the way it is. I think we can drop Voom! because people can just choose attacks like that if they want already. I like Deflect but, I think we should have it only apply to blaster type attacks. This gives it flavor and options and interesting interaction with specific items and avoids things like "I Deflect the rocket/force push" that don't make sense.

Though we might want to add a broader version of it that would apply to everything as a combat talent force users could take. Hmmm, do we want to end up saying "these combat talents are force user only" or just leave it up to common sense? I don't think we do actually. I figure any combat talent is fine really for anyone to have as long as they can explain it. Ok so just a combat talent that you can take (though I'm not sure what the explanation would be for non-force users in this case).

Ramsus wrote:Uh....aheh....yeah....um....awkward. If you knew more about expanded universe stuff you'd know there is no "magic". Even if people call it that it's still just the force. It's not the kind of info you'd get from watching (an admittedly good) show aimed at kids though, so I can't fault you for your misunderstanding. The potions and stuff basically fall under "sith alchemy" or "sith sorcery" though that's not really limited to the sith. Other force users do stuff like that too. Just not so much the Jedi. The Jedi are basically the disciplined but, straightforward and thinking inside the box group and other groups end up coloring outside the lines and blindly stumbling around and finding tricks to do with the force that Jedi would often go "huh, what?" at.

Magic by any other name...

(;

But yeah, I still don't think that every race should automatically have access to all the Unicorn talents. That's basically saying that everyone's a Jedi. It makes Jedi less unique, which in my mind is not the way to go. I also think Unicorns should still just keep their own "magic."

Ramsus wrote:If we do what you suggest for combat we end up with bigger ships almost always instantly killing smaller ones. You can't really have you X-wing dodging blasts from a Star Destroyer since the attacks would auto hit and it wouldn't make sense for the Star Destroyer's attacks to do tiny tiny amounts of damage. I know of ways you could make it work but, like I said before....it's ends up needlessly complicated.

^Not necessarily. Smaller ships could have combat options that allow them to avoid damage by dodging (Do a barrel roll!) or the larger ships could just ignore them entirely (like they tend to do in most of the Star Wars movies). Usually you don't see the Death Star focusing all it's fire on one X-wing because it would be like a giant focusing on one fly. It's just too big to worry about one super-speedy, super-small fighter in a giant firefight. The Death Star would let the cruddy Tie Fighters (and it's defense turrets - which aren't all that powerful) sweat the small stuff, while it would focus it's main guns on planets and capital ships.

Ramsus wrote:Maybe weapons should always add a few combat moves to the choices the character already has? That'd be a good way for them to have their own flavor but not be incredibly limiting.

Exactly. That was my original idea on the matter. Don't limit the user, just give them "bonus" abilities. I did mention "bonus" in my original post.

[/quote] Well, lightsabers can also be used to cut things like a really strong cutting torch. We should probably add that to the out of combat thing.

I like Parry the way it is. I think we can drop Voom! because people can just choose attacks like that if they want already. I like Deflect but, I think we should have it only apply to blaster type attacks. This gives it flavor and options and interesting interaction with specific items and avoids things like "I Deflect the rocket/force push" that don't make sense. [/quote]

^Definitely need to add the cutting torch thing.

Also, didn't know if you wanted to complicate the combat system by specifying blaster-specific weaponry or not. Alrighty.

Ramsus wrote:I figure any combat talent is fine really for anyone to have as long as they can explain it.

^Agreed.

No, that doesn't make everyone automatically force users. It just means anyone can be. Which is the case in Star Wars. If you don't want a force user/don't want more than X force users than the players simply don't choose those talents. If we don't open up the unicorn talents to everyone then most force users can't use telekinesis powers. That's nonsensical. There might be some Unicorn talents that would stay for only Unicorns but, I'm not currently aware of any that would make sense to prevent other force users from taking. I'm not really sure how to keep a "Unicorn magic" from what we currently have without taking away key options from every other force user. Of course, it's been a while since I've taken a look at the Unicorn Utility thread.

Like I said, we could devise a way for it to work. It just means basically making an entirely new combat mechanic from scratch that's much much more complicated than the current one if we want it to work well and be true to form for the setting. In my opinion it just isn't worth the effort and I like it better as skill checks as there will always still be plenty of normal combat for players to engage in anyway.
Edit: Also, having a type of "skill combat" means we might be able to come up with something more interesting to give players at Boon levels instead of the extra combat traits. Then again, maybe not. It's just an idle thought for now.

Sorry, must have missed bonus. Good idea then.
*shrug* As long as we don't get too complicated I think it will be fine since adding items adds a bit more complexity no matter what.

Hey Ramsus,

I'm still curious as to what you think about my spaceship combat ideas after considering my last point. I don't think we should worry about a Star Destroyer taking on an X-wing, because, again, the big guns never seem to sweat the small stuff in the movies. They're just too big and slow to hit something so small and fast. That's why they send out the Tie-Fighters.

Even in a combat system where you auto-hit, you just wouldn't ever put a Star Destroyer up against an X-wing. If you did, the Star Destroyer/other bucking big thing wouldn't have any attacks that could actually hurt the X-wing (to compensate for the too big vs. too small concept).

Except when you would? Because you can't really say what people are going to try to do and what they aren't. Only how they're supposed to go about doing it. I'm still of the opinion that anything that worked, made sense, and didn't provide abusable loopholes would end up way more complicated that would be required. And like I said before, it's not like there won't be plenty of regular non-skill based combat for characters to engage in. So, unless I'm missing some important reason why we actually need (or would gain something from having) space combat mechanics instead of just making it a skill challenge or such, I'm going to stick to that opinion.

Additionally I don't really like the idea that a star destroyer with dozens of turrets can't hurt an X-wing even though I know they can and vice-versa that X-wings can't damage star destroyers when I know that's possible too.

With all the updates, any chance this will revive?

Also, on the Unicorn issue, just give them their own tradition (like the Dathomeer or the Jansai) with a few different tricks than what Jedi get. They can still learn to be Jedi Knights of course, but Unicorn Mages are more "traditional".

TheMatthew and I are working on a LL/PT compatible(ish?) system based on Star Wars. When we're done it should prove simple enough for anyone familiar with this system to learn it and use it for Pony Star Wars type games.

Thanks to the existance of this topic and the fact that the utilities are now all everypony... I'm starting to want to build a Pony Jedi...

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:May the Horse be with you.

I don't care about the expansion itself, for the most part. But I think the expansion should definitely have that phrase right there as the title. Or at least have it pasted on the cover page.