Build Challenge - DPR Kings
+8
sunbeam
Hayatecooper
Doc pseudopolis
Mind Gamer
Zarhon
Ramsus
A1C Bronymous
Stairc -Dan Felder
12 posters
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Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Stairc -Dan Felder Tue Aug 20, 2013 2:41 pm
The Goal
Make a character that can deal more damage to a single creature over the course of a 5 round combat than any other character in the game.
The Purpose
Challenge your optimization skills, enjoy building cool characters and stress test the system - revealing the most broken elements of the game.
The Rewards
If you make a character that rules its DPR level category, your build and name will be listed on the DPR King Leader Board in this thread.
If you make a character so powerful that it shatters the system and makes us developers revise the talents/traits/items in question to make things more fair - you will receive a public badge of honor that proclaims you as an optimization king.
The Rules
Build a character using standard rules and level-appropriate gold amounts. Anything in any *official* handbook or expansion is legal. Third party stuff isn't allowed.
The King stands alone. Don't expect or account for any help from any other character. Your king must dish out the damage on his own.
There will be a DPR King for levels 1, 3, 6 and 10. Submit your builds to this thread of the appropriate levels. You can submit to one or more categories and you can submit multiple builds. However you must include...
1) A link to your character sheet in Google Drive (don't forget to change the sharing settings). You needn't have anything but the combat stuff completed, as the rest of the character sheet doesn't affect combat.
2) A written explanation in the submission post that explains precisely how the DPR is generated turn-by-turn over the 5 rounds.
3) A clear list of the DPR (damage per round - total up the damage dealt over 5 rounds by your character and then divide by 5) generated by your character.
The Judgment
This is an official yet informal challenge. After enough builds to construct a reliable leader board have been checked - I or another moderator will begin compiling the list of DPR Kings. In the meanwhile, make sure you audit one another's builds to make sure there are no rules issues that preclude your builds from greatness.
Enjoy.
Make a character that can deal more damage to a single creature over the course of a 5 round combat than any other character in the game.
The Purpose
Challenge your optimization skills, enjoy building cool characters and stress test the system - revealing the most broken elements of the game.
The Rewards
If you make a character that rules its DPR level category, your build and name will be listed on the DPR King Leader Board in this thread.
If you make a character so powerful that it shatters the system and makes us developers revise the talents/traits/items in question to make things more fair - you will receive a public badge of honor that proclaims you as an optimization king.
The Rules
Build a character using standard rules and level-appropriate gold amounts. Anything in any *official* handbook or expansion is legal. Third party stuff isn't allowed.
The King stands alone. Don't expect or account for any help from any other character. Your king must dish out the damage on his own.
There will be a DPR King for levels 1, 3, 6 and 10. Submit your builds to this thread of the appropriate levels. You can submit to one or more categories and you can submit multiple builds. However you must include...
1) A link to your character sheet in Google Drive (don't forget to change the sharing settings). You needn't have anything but the combat stuff completed, as the rest of the character sheet doesn't affect combat.
2) A written explanation in the submission post that explains precisely how the DPR is generated turn-by-turn over the 5 rounds.
3) A clear list of the DPR (damage per round - total up the damage dealt over 5 rounds by your character and then divide by 5) generated by your character.
The Judgment
This is an official yet informal challenge. After enough builds to construct a reliable leader board have been checked - I or another moderator will begin compiling the list of DPR Kings. In the meanwhile, make sure you audit one another's builds to make sure there are no rules issues that preclude your builds from greatness.
Enjoy.
Stairc -Dan Felder- Lead Designer
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
A1C Bronymous Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:06 pm
Man, if that had come up, like, 6 months ago, I'd have a good one for you.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Ramsus Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:09 pm
Do thematthew and I automatically just get the reward for our Derpy's Lightning build of doom? (I know it's around somewhere.) =P
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Stairc -Dan Felder Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:10 pm
You'll need to submit it here. =)
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:52 pm
A few questions!
1) Warlord abilities and other such things that "grant" damage to an (otherwise completely inactive) ally, or that require an ally target, are not counted /useless for the purpose of this challenge, correct?
2) Is the damage counted as maximum die values, or averages of dies? Cause there's quite a world of difference between doing flat, guaranteed damage, and rolling a d6, d8, d12, d20...
3) When dealing with randomness or unreliable effects (coin tosses, random effects, random targeting), do we assume only the wanted effects happen (e.g. you don't miss whilst blinded...), or do we roll on it (which sort of defeats the purpose of the challenge and makes it literally luck based)?
4) How are AOE attacks counted? Is this a 1on1 fight against a single opponent, or can it theoretically have infinite targets to choose from, in which case damage against such is taken into account, either individually, or as a whole?
5) How are conjurations you make treated? Can they be counted as "allies" for this challenge (for warlord abilities, for example)?
6) Does our "opponent" get to act against us with dealing damage (for purpose of reactions and interrupts, or do they just sit like a punching bag?
7) Can we assume characters start out as "bloodied", or are under a status condition we don't cause ourselves?
8 ) Do save ends effects on self/enemies count for as long as we want them to (so the enemy might save against an effect on demand, or never save, or you never save against an effect you put on yourself, or immediately save against it...)?
9) Does the targeted enemy count as "bloodied" at any point, or under a save ends condition that we didn't cause first?
10) How do we treat special moves? Do they trigger every time, on every valid roll, or never?
1) Warlord abilities and other such things that "grant" damage to an (otherwise completely inactive) ally, or that require an ally target, are not counted /useless for the purpose of this challenge, correct?
2) Is the damage counted as maximum die values, or averages of dies? Cause there's quite a world of difference between doing flat, guaranteed damage, and rolling a d6, d8, d12, d20...
3) When dealing with randomness or unreliable effects (coin tosses, random effects, random targeting), do we assume only the wanted effects happen (e.g. you don't miss whilst blinded...), or do we roll on it (which sort of defeats the purpose of the challenge and makes it literally luck based)?
4) How are AOE attacks counted? Is this a 1on1 fight against a single opponent, or can it theoretically have infinite targets to choose from, in which case damage against such is taken into account, either individually, or as a whole?
5) How are conjurations you make treated? Can they be counted as "allies" for this challenge (for warlord abilities, for example)?
6) Does our "opponent" get to act against us with dealing damage (for purpose of reactions and interrupts, or do they just sit like a punching bag?
7) Can we assume characters start out as "bloodied", or are under a status condition we don't cause ourselves?
8 ) Do save ends effects on self/enemies count for as long as we want them to (so the enemy might save against an effect on demand, or never save, or you never save against an effect you put on yourself, or immediately save against it...)?
9) Does the targeted enemy count as "bloodied" at any point, or under a save ends condition that we didn't cause first?
10) How do we treat special moves? Do they trigger every time, on every valid roll, or never?
Last edited by Zarhon on Tue Aug 20, 2013 5:25 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Mind Gamer Tue Aug 20, 2013 5:07 pm
I like to think that when the DPR and Nuke Kings have been crowned, they'll be sent up against the Immortal King. Perfect offense versus perfect defense. Which half is more broken?
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Doc pseudopolis Tue Aug 20, 2013 8:13 pm
I've got a Build for consideration.
Approximate turn schedule:
Your Turn 1: Charm targeting self, Blood pact, Blood is power (You: ongoing 7, cannot attack self. Target: Ongoing 7)
Target turn 1: takes 7 damage (Round 1 Total: 7 damage)
Your turn 2: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 2: ongoing 13 (Round 2 total: 20 damage+6D8+3D4)
Your turn 3: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 3: ongoing 19 (Round 3 total: 39 damage+12D8+6D4)
Your turn 4: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 4: ongoing 25 (Round 4 total: 64 damage+18D8+9D4)
Your turn 5: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 5: ongoing 31 (Round 5 total: 95 damage+24D8+12D4)
Estimated minimum total damage: 131 (95[ongoing total damage]+24[D8]+12[D4])
Both ongoing damage and directly inflicted damage would increase if Specials are applied each turn.
I believe I can increase the damage totals further by replacing firebolt with blind rage and sink your teeth in with Blind-fighting (+64 direct damage through blind rage [two frenzies after blind rage turn two, then 3 frenzies turns 3-5] in exchange for replacing one 2d8 turn 2 for a 1d12 and reducing the ongoing damage by 2 [95 to 93]) but it would place further assumption on both the user and the target repeatedly failing saving throws and as such would probably be more suited for a level 10 build.
- Level 6 DPR king candidate build, Red Sun:
Combat
Level 6
Combat Talents (note: only listed 5 talents most pertinent to the build)
[-1] Firebolt - Standard Attack
Deal 2d8 damage to target creature
[-1] Frenzy - Minor Attack
Deal 2d8 damage to a random creature.
[-1] Charm - Standard Utility
Target creature cannot attack you (save ends).
[-1] Blood Pact - Minor Utility
For the rest of the battle, at the beginning of your turn, you gain 1 energy and then lose 1
HP for each energy you have.
[-1] Blood is Power - Minor Utility
You and target creature each suffer 5 ongoing damage (save ends).
Equipment
Weapons
Fleshrender - 2000 Gold
Weapon
Whenever you damage a creature that is suffering from ongoing damage you may increase the ongoing damage that creature is suffering from by 2.
Armour
Trinkets
Energizing Amulet - 2000 Gold
Trinket
At the start of your turn, if you have less than 4 energy, you may gain 1 energy.
Training Diploma - 4000 Gold
Trinket
When you purchase this item, choose two traits that you meet the prerequisites for. While you have the Training Diploma equipped, you are considered to have the chosen traits. You may equip more than one Training Diploma at once.
Traits
Sink Your Teeth In
When you subject a creature to ongoing damage, increase that ongoing damage by 2.
Rapid Recovery
At the beginning of your turn, if you have less than 4 energy you gain 1 energy.
Gusher [Created by Zarhorn]
You deal +1d4 damage on combat talents when suffering ongoing damage.
Plague Eater
You have regeneration 4 while you are suffering from a (save ends) condition.
Fast Gambit
You may make an additional minor action each turn, but you cannot use it to make attacks.
Motion Blur
Prerequisite: Fast Gambit
You may use the minor action granted from Motion Blur to make attacks.
Special Ability
Wild Lightning
8: Deal 1d12 damage to a random enemy.
10: Deal 1d12 damage to a random creature, then deal 1d10 damage to another random creature, then deal 1d8 damage to a third random creature.
12: Use one of the combat talents you brought into battle at random without paying its energy cost.
Approximate turn schedule:
Your Turn 1: Charm targeting self, Blood pact, Blood is power (You: ongoing 7, cannot attack self. Target: Ongoing 7)
Target turn 1: takes 7 damage (Round 1 Total: 7 damage)
Your turn 2: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 2: ongoing 13 (Round 2 total: 20 damage+6D8+3D4)
Your turn 3: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 3: ongoing 19 (Round 3 total: 39 damage+12D8+6D4)
Your turn 4: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 4: ongoing 25 (Round 4 total: 64 damage+18D8+9D4)
Your turn 5: ongoing 7, blood pact (2), Firebolt+gusher, Frenzy+gusher X 2 (Deal 6D8+3D4, increase ongoing by 6)
Target turn 5: ongoing 31 (Round 5 total: 95 damage+24D8+12D4)
Estimated minimum total damage: 131 (95[ongoing total damage]+24[D8]+12[D4])
Both ongoing damage and directly inflicted damage would increase if Specials are applied each turn.
I believe I can increase the damage totals further by replacing firebolt with blind rage and sink your teeth in with Blind-fighting (+64 direct damage through blind rage [two frenzies after blind rage turn two, then 3 frenzies turns 3-5] in exchange for replacing one 2d8 turn 2 for a 1d12 and reducing the ongoing damage by 2 [95 to 93]) but it would place further assumption on both the user and the target repeatedly failing saving throws and as such would probably be more suited for a level 10 build.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Hayatecooper Tue Aug 20, 2013 8:56 pm
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1o9_NPd5HIe3QMfhJjWNTnFv8Lf2C1hJ4L0QkMpOAG-4/edit
The build is a level 10 DPR build focusing on Vorpal Sword and Gold Is Power. Though it has little defense, it can get Vorpal Sword off twice in five moves, making it good against both solo monsters and large groups.
Items the build has
Amulet of Adrenaline
Greater Reloader
Hawkeye
Special Move
8: Deal 1d8 damage to target creature and each creature adjacent to the target.
10: Deal 2d8 damage to target creature and that creature is blinded until the end of your next turn.
12: Deal 2d10 damage to up to six creatures and 1d10 damage to yourself.
The build works like this
Before battle: Amulet of Adrenaline allows you to start the battle with 7 pips
1. Hawkeye on target, Vorpal Sword doing 8d20 damage(+1d6 for hawkeye), so 9 if all 1's and 166 if all crits, vorpal crits allows the activation of all special moves(On average should be hitting at least one crit. Which should in turn activate more crits thanks to blaze.)
When done, Greater Reloader.
End with Pips =5
2. Use Psychic anomaly to give target vul 4, and then redirect focus to daze self.
End Pips = 8
3. Repeat turn 1 without the reloader and with +4 damage
End pips = 1
4. Use Lightning Bolt: 1d10+7
Ends pips = 0
5: Stab: 1d10
End pips = 1
It does rely pretty heavily on chaining with blaze, but it can do a decent amount of damage over the five turns.
The build is a level 10 DPR build focusing on Vorpal Sword and Gold Is Power. Though it has little defense, it can get Vorpal Sword off twice in five moves, making it good against both solo monsters and large groups.
Items the build has
Amulet of Adrenaline
Greater Reloader
Hawkeye
Special Move
8: Deal 1d8 damage to target creature and each creature adjacent to the target.
10: Deal 2d8 damage to target creature and that creature is blinded until the end of your next turn.
12: Deal 2d10 damage to up to six creatures and 1d10 damage to yourself.
The build works like this
Before battle: Amulet of Adrenaline allows you to start the battle with 7 pips
1. Hawkeye on target, Vorpal Sword doing 8d20 damage(+1d6 for hawkeye), so 9 if all 1's and 166 if all crits, vorpal crits allows the activation of all special moves(On average should be hitting at least one crit. Which should in turn activate more crits thanks to blaze.)
When done, Greater Reloader.
End with Pips =5
2. Use Psychic anomaly to give target vul 4, and then redirect focus to daze self.
End Pips = 8
3. Repeat turn 1 without the reloader and with +4 damage
End pips = 1
4. Use Lightning Bolt: 1d10+7
Ends pips = 0
5: Stab: 1d10
End pips = 1
It does rely pretty heavily on chaining with blaze, but it can do a decent amount of damage over the five turns.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Stairc -Dan Felder Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:07 pm
Zarhon wrote:A few questions!
1) Warlord abilities and other such things that "grant" damage to an (otherwise completely inactive) ally, or that require an ally target, are not counted /useless for the purpose of this challenge, correct?
2) Is the damage counted as maximum die values, or averages of dies? Cause there's quite a world of difference between doing flat, guaranteed damage, and rolling a d6, d8, d12, d20...
3) When dealing with randomness or unreliable effects (coin tosses, random effects, random targeting), do we assume only the wanted effects happen (e.g. you don't miss whilst blinded...), or do we roll on it (which sort of defeats the purpose of the challenge and makes it literally luck based)?
4) How are AOE attacks counted? Is this a 1on1 fight against a single opponent, or can it theoretically have infinite targets to choose from, in which case damage against such is taken into account, either individually, or as a whole?
5) How are conjurations you make treated? Can they be counted as "allies" for this challenge (for warlord abilities, for example)?
6) Does our "opponent" get to act against us with dealing damage (for purpose of reactions and interrupts, or do they just sit like a punching bag?
7) Can we assume characters start out as "bloodied", or are under a status condition we don't cause ourselves?
8 ) Do save ends effects on self/enemies count for as long as we want them to (so the enemy might save against an effect on demand, or never save, or you never save against an effect you put on yourself, or immediately save against it...)?
9) Does the targeted enemy count as "bloodied" at any point, or under a save ends condition that we didn't cause first?
10) How do we treat special moves? Do they trigger every time, on every valid roll, or never?
1) This is a 1-on-1 battle. If you need other players around, like for warlord abilities, you don't qualify as the king. A support-king would be awesome, but that's a different contest.
2) Expected value - meaning the 'average' result of a die in question. D6 is worth 3.5, d8 is 4.5 etc.
3) Everything is based on expected value. If you're blinded, you need to expect to miss half your future attacks - so cut the damage in half.
4) I suggest reading the Goal again.
5) You can certainly make conjurations (they're spawned by your powers). Basically, you're doing this 1 on 1. So if you make your own conjurations, you can use ally-based powers on them.
6) This is a punching bag challenge.
7) You start out at max HP and no conditions. Everyone starts at equal footing.
Again, expected value. You don't get to assume a best-case scenario.9) The target is of infinite hp punching bag.
10) Expected value. Every time you roll a d8, you have a 1/8 chance of triggering the move. That's the value your d8 roll provides.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
sunbeam Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:52 am
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NfTuA-qO6IU6QqB6OLRhK_ac76jRYw5RnV1cd8Fc7tM/edit
I solemnly promise that I had this idea before I saw Hayate's Build. I've had it ever since I noticed that with Rapid Recovery, Amulet of Rapid Recovery, Chain of the Drunken Master, Trance, and Redirect Focus, you could pull off a <roll twice> Snicker-Snack Every other turn. My only limit was that Gold is Power was only takeable once, which I thought was on purpose to avoid this build and really make Vorpal Sword the Be-All End-All of your items if you chose to use it.
But that was not the case, so behold, my Level 10 championship contender.
How long until this thing closes, anyways?
I solemnly promise that I had this idea before I saw Hayate's Build. I've had it ever since I noticed that with Rapid Recovery, Amulet of Rapid Recovery, Chain of the Drunken Master, Trance, and Redirect Focus, you could pull off a <roll twice> Snicker-Snack Every other turn. My only limit was that Gold is Power was only takeable once, which I thought was on purpose to avoid this build and really make Vorpal Sword the Be-All End-All of your items if you chose to use it.
But that was not the case, so behold, my Level 10 championship contender.
How long until this thing closes, anyways?
Last edited by sunbeam on Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Stairc -Dan Felder Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:58 am
It shall always, always be open. I'm just going to give it a while before I post the initial leaderboards - else I'd be updating constantly.sunbeam wrote:How long until this thing closes, anyways?
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:04 pm
Here's my level 3 build, the "Bloody Spellblade", utilizing the Gusher trait to its maximum potential.
The flaws or unreliability of this build can be negated in the higher-level versions (in the form of save ends-penalties for the enemy, using plaguebearer armor to give the enemy your 2 ongoing damage, or Demonscale (this makes barter in blood unable to trigger due to resist, however, so you need to substitute it with "Blood is Power", doing 5 ongoing damage to self and the enemy), or getting the Sense Weakness, Hex, Surefire Hex, or Second Chance traits.
I think I'll make a higher-level version later.
Edit: Are spoiler tags enough, or do we need to make a google doc version?
Edit edit: Whoops, forgot to add a trait! Builds still in construction, this needs some statistics done! Until it is, I'll be adding "second chance" as a placeholder.
- Bloody Spellblade - lvl3:
- Bloody Spellblade - lvl3
Combat Talents:
[+3] Blood Slash - Standard Attack
Deal 2 damage to target creature. You suffer 2 ongoing damage (save ends)
[-1] Lightning Bolt - Standard Attack
Deal 1d10+X damage to target creature where X equals the number of energy you spent last turn.
[-1] Barter in Blood - Minor Utility
Target creature is subjected to your “Bloody Contract” (save ends). While the creature is subjected to your “Bloody Contract”, it suffers 1d6 damage whenever you are dealt damage.
[-3] Heartseeker - Standard Attack
Deal 2d12 damage to target creature
[-7] Wild Abandon - Minor Utility
For the rest of the battle you suffer Vulnerability 4, and once per round when you make a single-target attack, you may have that attack deal +2d6 damage.
------------------
Combat Items:
Spellblade - 3000 Gold
Weapon
Once per round, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Bladespell - Reaction Attack
Trigger - You make an attack using a standard action
Effect - Choose one of the following;
A) Deal 3 damage to target creature.
B) Make a saving throw
C) Target ally gains 4 temporary hp.
Greater Reloader - 2500 Gold [Created by Bronymous]
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Reload - Free Utility [1/Battle]
If you spent 7 or more energy this turn, gain 5 energy
------------------
Trait:
Gusher [Created by Zarhorn]
You deal +1d4 damage on combat talents when suffering ongoing damage.
Second Chance - Immediate Interrupt [3/Battle]
Trigger - An creature rolls a die and you dislike the result
Effect - The triggering creature rerolls the die. You may choose which of the two results is used.
Note: This trait is a placeholder for now, until I determine if it is optimal or not. For the build, it would be used to re-roll whenever you save against your own Blood Slash-caused ongoing damage, or when the enemy saves against Barter in Blood (both are important for the build). If neither of those are needed, it can be freely used to re-roll any of the damage dies on turn 5 (when save ends are no longer important), to boost the overall DPR.
------------------
Special Move:
Wild Lightning
8: Deal 1d12 damage to a random enemy.
10: Deal 1d12 damage to a random creature, then deal 1d10 damage to another random creature, then deal 1d8 damage to a third random creature.
12: Use one of the combat talents you brought into battle at random without paying its energy cost.
------------------
The idea behind this build is utilizing the "Gusher" trait and "Wild abandon" with the "Spellblade", by inflicting yourself with ongoing damage. "Blood Slash" gives you ongoing damage, which activates "Gusher", and when combined with "Barter in Blood", causes the enemy to take 1d6 damage at the start of your turn, due to you taking damage from ongoing.
Note: The enemy goes before you. You intentionally delay your action to do so. This improves your save ends chances.
Turn 1 - 4 pips
Blood Slash (2 dmg) + Spellblade, effect "A"(3 +1d4 dmg) + Wild Abandon + Greater Reloader
Turn1 damage: 5+1d4 damage (flat)
You give yourself 2 ongoing damage (save ends) to deal 2 damage, and that triggers a "Spellblade", which deals 3 damage. You then use "Wild Abandon" to give yourself a permanent 4 Vuln (even with the 2 ongoing damage constantly active, you'll still be left with 6 hp in the end, so it's okay) but gain +2d6 damage for the rest of the fight, followed by activating the "Greater Reloader" to bring yourself to 5 pips. Assuming you didn't save against your 2 ongoing damage, you now have "Gusher" activated, so you deal +1d4 on your future combat talents!
Turn 2 - 5 pips
Lightning Bolt (1d10+7+1d4+2d6 dmg) + Spellblade (3+1d4 dmg) + Barter in Blood
Turn2 damage: 10+2d4+2d6+1d10 damage
Special Move extra: 1d12+1d10+1d8 (best case scenario ONLY! Not recommended to risk it!)
Use "Lightning Bolt" to gain a guaranteed 7 damage from your spent pips, and add the "Gusher"+"Wild Abandon" bonus damage on top of it. There's a chance of the 1d10 special move activating as well, but DO NOT use it - it will lead to an early KO if you take any more than 2 damage from it, due to your vuln. Afterwards, trigger the "Spellblade" (apply "Gusher" to it as well), then use "Barter in Blood" to make the enemy suffer +1d6 damage at the start of your next few turns (it triggers from your self-inflicted ongoing damage).
Turn 3 - 3 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + Heartseeker (2d12+2d6+1d4) + Spellblade (3+1d4)
Turn3 damage: 3+3d4+3d6+2d12 damage
Special Move extra: Two d12 specials might trigger, for either:
- No effect (Wild Abandon/Barter in Blood)
- 2+1d4 damage (Blood Slash)
- 1d10+X+1d4 damage (Lightning Bolt)
- 2d12+1d4 damage (Heartseeker)
Assuming you still have ongoing damage and the enemy didn't save against it, "Barter in Blood" triggers. You then follow up with a "Heartseeker" and "Spellblade", adding more damage. If you're lucky, you also trigger your d12 special up to two times, allowing you to get up to two "free" ability uses. These might do nothing (Wild Abandon, Barter in Blood), or deal more damage (2+1d4, or 1d10+X+1d4, or 2d12).
Turn 4 - 0 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + Blood Slash (2+1d4) + Spellblade (3+1d4+2d6)
Turn4 damage: 5+3d4+3d6 damage
At this point, you probably saved against ongoing damage, or maybe you didn't. No matter! Just use "Blood Slash" again, combo'd with the "Spellblade". Wild abandon triggers from the Spellblade as well.
Turn 5 - 3 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + Heartseeker (2d12+1d4+2d6) + Spellblade (3+1d4)
Turn5 damage: 3+3d4+3d6+2d12 damage
Special Move extra: Two d12 specials might trigger, for either:
- No effect (Wild Abandon/Barter in Blood)
- 2+1d4 damage (Blood Slash)
- 1d10+X+1d4 damage (Lightning Bolt)
- 2d12+1d4 damage (Heartseeker)
For the final turn, there's really not much else to do but use "Heartseeker" and the "Spellblade" again. Good damage, and another chance for special moves.
Final damage: 26 (Blood Slash+Spellblade+Lightning Bolt "Pips damage") + 12d4 (Gusher) + 11d6 (Wild Abandon + Barter in Blood) + 1d10 (Lightning Bolt) + 4d12 damage (Heartseeker)
Max rolled value: 198 damage, Max DPR = 38,8
Min rolled value: 54 damage, Min DPR = 10,6
Special Move potential: 4x d12 special for a 3/5 chance of "free attacks" (see "special move extra"), 1x d10 (only if it does no damage to you), + potential for the crit-granted abilities triggering even more crits.
Note: If you manage to get a 1d10 special at turn 5 out of a d12 special-granted Lightning Bolt, use it. You'll get KO'd probably, but the enemy might take a bunch of damage as well, which is the goal of this build anyway.
Assuming you aren't unlucky with ongoing damage and barter in blood, you gain a lot of damage, both rolled and guaranteed/flat. Crits can also boost it (and due to their nature, can trigger themselves infinitely, though at a low chance).
The flaws or unreliability of this build can be negated in the higher-level versions (in the form of save ends-penalties for the enemy, using plaguebearer armor to give the enemy your 2 ongoing damage, or Demonscale (this makes barter in blood unable to trigger due to resist, however, so you need to substitute it with "Blood is Power", doing 5 ongoing damage to self and the enemy), or getting the Sense Weakness, Hex, Surefire Hex, or Second Chance traits.
I think I'll make a higher-level version later.
Edit: Are spoiler tags enough, or do we need to make a google doc version?
Edit edit: Whoops, forgot to add a trait! Builds still in construction, this needs some statistics done! Until it is, I'll be adding "second chance" as a placeholder.
Last edited by Zarhon on Wed Aug 21, 2013 11:15 pm; edited 9 times in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
sunbeam Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:37 pm
You have two traits at level 3, so you can pick something else to strengthen the build, since you only have gusher right now.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:08 pm
Oh? Missed that! I will then.sunbeam wrote:You have two traits at level 3, so you can pick something else to strengthen the build, since you only have gusher right now.
Last edited by Zarhon on Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:23 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Xel Unknown Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:19 pm
I'd suggest using Blood of The Wolf. So that the build doesn't kill you so quickly... After all no point being a king if you pass out after those five turns.Zarhon wrote:Oh? Missed that! I will then.sunbeam wrote:You have two traits at level 3, so you can pick something else to strengthen the build, since you only have gusher right now.
Or go with the Hex option for trait to help with the roll outcome issue.
Last edited by Xel Unknown on Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:21 pm
Well, it works for the challenge, and you can always succeed a save after your 5th turn... It's more of an issue if it happens before that.Xel Unknown wrote:I'd suggest using Blood of The Wolf. So that the build doesn't kill you so quickly... After all no point being a king if you pass out after those five turns.Zarhon wrote:Oh? Missed that! I will then.sunbeam wrote:You have two traits at level 3, so you can pick something else to strengthen the build, since you only have gusher right now.
Hmmm. I'm not sure on the math, but the following two seem like good choices:
- Sense Weakness:
- Sense Weakness
Targets suffering from (save ends) effects have vulnerability 2 against your attacks.
Or
- Second Chance:
- Second Chance - Immediate Interrupt [3/Battle]
Trigger - An creature rolls a die and you dislike the result
Effect - The triggering creature rerolls the die. You may choose which of the two results is used.
Which of the two would be better for the overall DPR, statistically? A +2 to damage for 90% of the build's individual attacks, providing +12 damage total (but relying on Barter with Blood), or a improvement of both of the "save ends" odds / damage roll boost, which the build relies on? Any statistics buffs around?
Last edited by Zarhon on Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Xel Unknown Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:06 pm
Another option is taking the Hex trait...
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:09 pm
I considered that - but it only affects barter in blood (blood slash doesn't count - I'm not my own enemy), and it's only -3. I think an outright re-roll is stronger, odds wise, especially since you can re-roll it more than once, in a row, if needed.Xel Unknown wrote:Another option is taking the Hex trait...
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Dusk Raven Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:07 am
A DPR challenge, huh? I think I've got a level 10 that I'm using that I can dig up and present...
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Xel Unknown Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:38 am
I argue that Hex is better for it's upgradeableness at later levels... But I guess you've got a point the re-roll power could be a lot more useful overall.Zarhon wrote:I considered that - but it only affects barter in blood (blood slash doesn't count - I'm not my own enemy), and it's only -3. I think an outright re-roll is stronger, odds wise, especially since you can re-roll it more than once, in a row, if needed.Xel Unknown wrote:Another option is taking the Hex trait...
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
sunbeam Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:41 am
I think the re-roll trait is better at level 3, but the level 5 &6 traits could be persistent and surefire hex. I'm not sure if it's worth it, though, since it only adds about 7.5 damage to the build.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Mind Gamer Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:44 am
Well, there are multiple levels to the challenge, aren't there... As in, the Level 3 challenge (I believe that's the one...) is only for characters at that level. Possible future upgrades don't count. However, given there's a seperate Level 6 challenge, the Hex upgrade build could be better there.
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Zarhon Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:13 pm
Revised the gusher build a bit, thanks to some Skype suggestions:
- replaced "Heartseeker" with "Firebolt", giving it a slightly lower damage output and a few pips "wasted", but a higher/better special move value (2d8, so a 25% chance of getting a d8 crit, which gives 1d12 damage) and allowing me to reapply Barter In Blood for when the enemy saves against it, thanks to the lower pip cost.
- Added "Second Chance", for the purpose of keeping "Gusher" active, keeping Barter in Blood active, or boosting damage rolls at turn 5 (in that order).
- There are now two possible options to use at Turn 4, depending on the pip count, and whether BiB effect or your ongoing damage is up: A choice between using Firebolt (for more damage) or Blood Slash (to have pips for a Firebolt on turn 5 or to keep BiB up).
- replaced "Heartseeker" with "Firebolt", giving it a slightly lower damage output and a few pips "wasted", but a higher/better special move value (2d8, so a 25% chance of getting a d8 crit, which gives 1d12 damage) and allowing me to reapply Barter In Blood for when the enemy saves against it, thanks to the lower pip cost.
- Added "Second Chance", for the purpose of keeping "Gusher" active, keeping Barter in Blood active, or boosting damage rolls at turn 5 (in that order).
- There are now two possible options to use at Turn 4, depending on the pip count, and whether BiB effect or your ongoing damage is up: A choice between using Firebolt (for more damage) or Blood Slash (to have pips for a Firebolt on turn 5 or to keep BiB up).
- Bloody Spellblade revised - lvl3:
- Bloody Spellblade - lvl3
Combat Talents:
[+3] Blood Slash - Standard Attack
Deal 2 damage to target creature. You suffer 2 ongoing damage (save ends)
[-1] Lightning Bolt - Standard Attack
Deal 1d10+X damage to target creature where X equals the number of energy you spent last turn.
[-1] Barter in Blood - Minor Utility
Target creature is subjected to your “Bloody Contract” (save ends). While the creature is subjected to your “Bloody Contract”, it suffers 1d6 damage whenever you are dealt damage.
[-1] Firebolt - Standard Attack
Deal 2d8 damage to target creature
[-7] Wild Abandon - Minor Utility
For the rest of the battle you suffer Vulnerability 4, and once per round when you make a single-target attack, you may have that attack deal +2d6 damage.
------------------
Combat Items:
Spellblade - 3000 Gold
Weapon
Once per round, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Bladespell - Reaction Attack
Trigger - You make an attack using a standard action
Effect - Choose one of the following;
A) Deal 3 damage to target creature.
B) Make a saving throw
C) Target ally gains 4 temporary hp.
Greater Reloader - 2500 Gold [Created by Bronymous]
Trinket
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent.
[0] Reload - Free Utility [1/Battle]
If you spent 7 or more energy this turn, gain 5 energy
------------------
Trait:
Gusher [Created by Zarhorn]
You deal +1d4 damage on combat talents when suffering ongoing damage.
Second Chance - Immediate Interrupt [3/Battle]
Trigger - An creature rolls a die and you dislike the result
Effect - The triggering creature rerolls the die. You may choose which of the two results is used.
Note: Since you can re-apply BiB most of the turns, the reroll is used to ensure you don't save against your own ongoing damage, to sustain "gusher".
------------------
Special Move:
Wild Lightning
8: Deal 1d12 damage to a random enemy.
10: Deal 1d12 damage to a random creature, then deal 1d10 damage to another random creature, then deal 1d8 damage to a third random creature.
12: Use one of the combat talents you brought into battle at random without paying its energy cost.
Note: For the build, these are the potential results of rolling a d12 special (which itself is gotten from the d8 special move):
- No effect (Wild Abandon/Barter in Blood)
- 2+1d4 damage (Blood Slash)
- 1d10+X+1d4 damage (Lightning Bolt)
- 2d8+1d4 damage (Firebolt)
So, a 3/5 chance of getting more damage, if you crit on your d8's bonus damage.
------------------
The idea behind this build is utilizing the "Gusher" trait and "Wild abandon" with the "Spellblade", by inflicting yourself with ongoing damage. "Blood Slash" gives you ongoing damage, which activates "Gusher", and when combined with "Barter in Blood", causes the enemy to take 1d6 damage at the start of your turn, due to you taking damage from ongoing.
Note: The enemy goes before you. You intentionally delay your action to do so. This improves your save ends chances.
Turn 1 - 4 pips
Blood Slash (2 dmg) + Spellblade, effect "A"(3 +1d4 dmg) + Wild Abandon + Greater Reloader
Turn1 damage: 5+1d4 damage (flat)
Note: Use Second Chance to prevent a save vs ongoing damage!
You give yourself 2 ongoing damage (save ends) to deal 2 damage, and that triggers a "Spellblade", which deals 3 damage. You then use "Wild Abandon" to give yourself a permanent 4 Vuln (even with the 2 ongoing damage constantly active, you'll still be left with 6 hp in the end, so it's okay) but gain +2d6 damage for the rest of the fight, followed by activating the "Greater Reloader" to bring yourself to 5 pips. Assuming you didn't save against your 2 ongoing damage (use a reroll if you didn't), you now have "Gusher" activated, so you deal +1d4 on your future combat talents!
Turn 2 - 5 pips
Lightning Bolt (1d10+7+1d4+2d6 dmg) + Spellblade (3+1d4 dmg) + Barter in Blood
Turn2 damage: 10+2d4+2d6+1d10 damage
Special Move extra: 1d12+1d10+1d8 (best case scenario ONLY! Not recommended to risk it!)
Use "Lightning Bolt" to gain a guaranteed 7 damage from your spent pips, and add the "Gusher"+"Wild Abandon" bonus damage on top of it. There's a chance of the 1d10 special move activating as well, but DO NOT use it - it will lead to an early KO if you take any more than 2 damage from it, due to your vuln. Afterwards, trigger the "Spellblade" (apply "Gusher" to it as well), then use "Barter in Blood" to make the enemy suffer 1d6+1d4 damage (with "Gusher") at the start of your next few turns (it triggers from your self-inflicted ongoing damage).
Turn 3 - 3 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + Firebolt (2d8+2d6+1d4) + Spellblade (3+1d4) + Barter in Blood (if removed by enemy)
Turn3 damage: 3+3d4+3d6+2d8 damage
Special Move Extra: Two chances of triggering a d8 special move (25% chance), which grants an extra +1d2 damage per crit. This can also trigger a d12 special move in itself.
Assuming you still have ongoing damage and the enemy didn't save against it, "Barter in Blood" will trigger. You then follow up with a "Heartseeker" and "Spellblade", adding more damage. If the enemy saved against it, re-apply "Barter in Blood". If you're lucky, you also trigger your d8 special up to two times, giving you 1d12+1d4 damage for each. These in turn can trigger the d12 special move, which might:
- do nothing (Wild Abandon, Barter in Blood)
- or deal more damage (2+1d4, or 1d10+X+1d4, or 2d8+1d4).
Turn 4 - 1/2 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + either Firebolt (2d8+1d4) OR Blood Slash (2+1d4) + Spellblade (3+1d4+2d6) + Barter in Blood (if removed by enemy)
Turn4 damage: 3+3d4+3d6+2d8 OR 5+3d4+3d6 damage
Special Move Extra (option A only): Two chances of triggering a d8 special move (25% chance), which grants an extra +1d2 damage per crit. This can also trigger a d12 special move in itself.
There are two ways this turn can go:
A) If you still have ongoing damage on yourself, the enemy didn't save against "Barter in Blood", and you have 2 pips, use "Firebolt", as before, giving you some decent damage, and leaving you with 1 pip to use. Optionally, you might want to skip re-applying Barter in Blood, as a firebolt is stronger in value.
B) If you don't have ongoing damage on you (due to bad luck and Second Chance being used up), have only 1 pip at this point, or the enemy no longer has the "Barter in Blood" effect (meaning you need to reapply it), use "Blood Slash".
Whichever option you use, combo it with the "Spellblade". "Wild Abandon" triggers from the "Spellblade" as well, so you can use it in either scenario.
Turn 5 - 1/4 pips
Barter in blood triggers (1d6+1d4) + Firebolt (2d8+1d4+2d6) + Spellblade (3+1d4)
Turn5 damage: 3+3d4+3d6+2d8 damage
Special Move Extra: Two chances of triggering a d8 special move (25% chance), which grants an extra +1d2 damage per crit. This can also trigger a d12 special move in itself.
For the final turn, there's really not much else to do but use "Firebolt" and the "Spellblade" again. Good damage, and another chance for special moves. If you have leftover uses of Second Chance, use it liberally on the die rolls (particularly the d8's).
------------------
Final damage:
Option A happened on turn #4
24 (Blood Slash+Spellblade+Lightning Bolt "Pips damage") + 12d4 (Gusher) + 11d6 (Wild Abandon + Barter in Blood) + 1d10 (Lightning Bolt) + 6d8 damage (Firebolt)
Max rolled value: 196 damage, Max DPR = 39,2
Min rolled value: 54 damage, Min DPR = 10,8
Special Move potential: 6 x d8 specials (+1d12 damage per special trigger) + anything that triggers from the specials itself
Option B happened on turn #4
26 (Blood Slash+Spellblade+Lightning Bolt "Pips damage") + 12d4 (Gusher) + 11d6 (Wild Abandon + Barter in Blood) + 1d10 (Lightning Bolt) + 4d8 damage (Firebolt)
Max rolled value: 182 damage, Max DPR = 36,4
Min rolled value: 54 damage, Min DPR = 10,8
Special Move potential: 4 x d8 specials (+1d12 damage per special trigger) + anything that triggers from the specials itself
Note: If you manage to get a 1d10 special at turn 5 out of a Wild Lightning d12 special (gotten from a Wild Lightning d8), use it. You'll get KO'd, but the enemy might take a bunch of damage as well, which is the goal of this build anyway.
Assuming you aren't unlucky with ongoing damage and barter in blood, you gain a lot of damage, both rolled and guaranteed/flat. Crits can also boost it (and due to their nature, can trigger more crits, though at a low chance).
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Ramsus Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:48 am
Behold, High Roller and weep! (thematthew and I worked on this one together a long time ago. thematthew supplied the math analysis but, it doesn't include the maths for Second Chance. Also, I'm not sure if this is presented in the way Dan likes. So any help with those two issues would be appreciated. I imagine the math on using Second Chance intelligently might be kinda hard.)
Edit: This submission is for level 3.
Edit 2:Looks like the math is a bit off, for some reason thematthew must have forgotten that Critical Blow would also gain the benefit of Unacceptable (and possibly Fool Me Twice). Nvm, just misread things.
Edit: This submission is for level 3.
Edit 2:
- Maths:
Critfisher alone: Five 1 in 12 chances of critical
With Unacceptable: Five 1 in 11 chances of critical
With Fool Me Twice: Five 1 in 11 chances of critical, and five 1 in 11 chances of doubling your dice next turn
With Crushing Blow: Adds a 1 in 12 chance of crit every crit.
Ergo:
Turn without FMT: Critfisher(~42% if 0-1 1's rolled, ~36% if more than 1 1 rolled)
If Crit: 20% chance of spend 2 pips and try again
40% chance of try again and gain a pip
20% chance of 7d12 damage with a ~58% chance of going again (~64% with Unacceptable)
20% chance of 3d12 damage 25% chance of going again (~27% with Unacceptable)
AND a 8% chance of going again (~9% with Unacceptable)
Turn with FMT: Critfisher(~84% if 0-1 1's rolled, ~72% if more than 1 1 rolled)
If Crit: 20% chance of spend 2 pips and try again
40% chance of try again and gain a pip
20% chance of 7d12 damage with a ~116% chance of going again (~128% with Unacceptable)
20% chance of 3d12 damage 50% chance of going again (~54% with Unacceptable)
AND a 16% chance of going again (~18% with Unacceptable)
Last edited by Ramsus on Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Build Challenge - DPR Kings
Xel Unknown Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:18 am
I was going to say that Unacceptable and Fool me Twice can't combo... But after a re-read of that one... It's wording does allow such a combo... Cuase you don't auto-reroll on 1s now.
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