Luna's Command: The Wibbly-Wobbly Saga (Looking for No More replacement)

AProcrastinatingWriter wrote:Sorry, but without the racial/utility talent that specifically allows you to sense magic, sensing a specific type of magic is difficult. Magic in general, is there magic there, I bend the rules on but specific location spells require specific utility talents or a higher-than-expected Arcana roll.

I can understand you wanting to run it that way, but the racial you talk about just allows us to see magic by a Perception check...

Arcana IS meant to cover a good deal of magic related checks, including looking for magic and junk...

Then look at it this way: for certain tasks, I am running a slightly higher DC than one would normally encounter.

I don't want to sound like I'm arguing or anything, but isn't that literally the entire point of the Arcana skill? I mean, you can't actually "do magic" without Magecraft or reflavoring utility talents anyway. I was under the impression that racial talent just let you use Perception instead of Arcana to sense it.

Also racials are UNCANGEABLE for most of the campaign. And that only changes if you are either A) A Changeling, and even that's limited to defualts B) Take the Evolution Destiny...

So yeah... Also it has been said that Magical Attunement doesn't do ANYTHING for a high-arcana character.

Mostly I just don't understand this choice, and I'm ranting to hopefully somehow get a responce that better explains such reasoning you have for this abitray choice...

Also in rectrospect I am regreting deeply the fact I went with the default hippogriff racials... I didn't think I'd end up feeling /that/ of all things.

It's a shame you don't want to sound like you're arguing because those are some pretty good arguments you have going there.

*shrugs* It was a bad decision on my part and under what mild scrutiny you have shown here it has already fallen apart. The text remains unchanged for entirely different reasons, however.

You may change racials pending review the next time the group receives XP, by the way.

So, how big is this rock anyway?

That's actually a good point. I was assuming it was tiny, but it might be a giant Monolith-esque thing...

Good question. It is tinyish, one would estimate about as tall as three quarters of a sitting timbewolf. Only two-thirds of its height, presuming that information is correct, is sticking up aboveground.

DOUB<LE PO>ST

Okay, so...Xel.

Why have you not yet passed along the extremely pertinent information I have given you so that the game can continue?

Sorry about that... I've been derping about what to post for a while with Lunar it seems. I'll get to it right now.

Oh, we are both so screwed...

For once my OOC "Don't touch it, it might be fatal" belief turns out to be correct!

Alright, let's get serious now. I wasn't expecting the insta-gib (I was expecting large damage though), and if anything I would have liked an Endurance check, but this is what happens when you don't correct someone's interpretation of something your character shouldn't know...

EDIT: I've decided to remove this, to see what you can do. If things look back, I'll re-add it...

Let's move people!

Brilliant also has Advanced Ponykinesis and still has a pseudo-magic point because of Spellchild so it might be better for her to do it. Still, without a destination in mind we can reach in 10 minutes or less (20 if Composed and Brilliant trade off), we're kinda doomed.

EDIT: I forgot, she used her free Spellchild already to give herself Stealth Mode earlier. Whoops.

Paper Shadow wrote:Alright, let's get serious now. I wasn't expecting the insta-gib (I was expecting large damage though), and if anything I would have liked an Endurance check, but this is what happens when you don't correct someone's interpretation of something your character shouldn't know..

Alright, I aplogize in advance if I offend anybody. I'm not really angry and I don't think anything I'm about to say is offensive, but who knows! So, apologies in advance, for it was only my intention to explain myself, not to offend anybody.

By the rules I had set up in my head for Equestria long before I ran this campaign, the creatures in Equestria go against the laws of physics just by existing. They require magic to live, and cut off from it fall to pieces as a misshapen, colorful bag of bones and organs that have no chance of recovering. Being separated from magic, somehow, is an instant death sentence, and a gruesome one at that.

When I said that you all encountered the rock, I didn't think about these rules when I basically said it nullified magic - not at first, anyway. But when Scorch went to pick up the rock, or perhaps before then, I suddenly and violently remembered. And what happened?

I stopped you. I broke the rules of gamemastering and stopped a player from making a choice. I did this because that choice would have killed them.

Then I gave knowledge of precisely what the danger was to someone after they made a DC 15 Arcana check - about as low as I could go without being ridiculous. And then, because I phrased the warning badly, two people went ahead and touched the rock anyway.

By all rights, by the laws of magic I have set up in this campaign, it should have struck you permanently dead instantly. But you know what? I went ahead and broke my rules. I merely stopped you guys's hearts and then gave a DC 15 Heal check - much lower than it should be - to make sure that you survived, with a DC 20 of making sure you stabilized immediately - again, much lower than it should be. That is three times I have broken my personal code of Gamemastering because I felt that making sure your characters didn't die was more important - one time when I stopped you, one time when I warped the reality of the game and lied about what would actually happen in order to protect you, and one time when I set the DC much lower than it had any right to be.

I am doing literally everything in my power to make sure your characters survive, have not allowed the stone to have any lasting negative repercussions, and have even opened up a wide escape opportunity to make sure you aren't caught by the guards. But you're right; I didn't give you an Endurance check when you touched the stone.

I'm sorry.

I can understand and agree with the idea that everything in Equestria have magic in them. Bet the more magic in an entry the more self-aware the animal becomes.

But yeah... Only was given this rock is basically a magical black hole. The idea of it interacting in harmful ways with the magical races wasn't something we thought up until afterwards.

It's fine that it happened like this without realizing it. But I do hope it doesn't happen again.

Dear Princess Luna, today I learned that messing with unknown magic can be catastrophic!

I can understand the point about Equestrian creatures and magic, which is also true in my headcanon to a lesser extent (based on something Lauren Faust said about each race having their own magic). Of course, you could have, when Scorch first reached for the stone, simply told him that he could feel the entropy coming off it, perhaps even making his hand go numb. Assuming there's a gradient in the stone's effect before contact is made.

I see...

I'm not angry at you, and I understand what you are getting at, but keep in mind my lack of knowledge of what was happening behind the scenes. When I wrote that, I was expecting Heal DCs of 25-30. I didn't think we'd get out of here all alive unless we spent at least three magic points. I didn't even know that the rock was suppose to kill. I expected gradually magic drain and weakness, or perhaps an explosion, not a straight flat-line, so when I saw that I was instantly comatose, I felt something was wrong. That's why I said I expected an Endurance check, or any check for that matter. I knew the significance of magic as life, but I expected it to be a gradual, flowing thing, not an on-off switch. So that's why I said I expected a check...

But I think this would be a good point to ask why the rock was there in the first place. Not on a roleplaying level, but on a mechanical one. Obviously, if you have an answer for that, and it's spoilers (despite this being a discussion on its purpose as a gameplay feature), then by all means just say, and I won't ask again until I feel like I need to. But what did you attempt to accomplish with the addition of that rock? What were we suppose to do with it? Because, if you initially didn't allow Arcana checks on it, and Perception checks revealed very little (until a CMC, which you should know can't be something to rely on), and merely touching it resulted in insta-death, and you didn't show any example of how fatal it could be had you stuck to your personal dragon GM code (and, from what I got out of it, you actually presented it as a way to count the shackles and wanted us to use it), then please understand that, as a player who has had some experience in Video Game Level Design (at least, that's what I like to think), I feel that the purpose of that rock was mainly to kill someone, and I feel that's some Mines of Madness *yay* right there...

Now, had you decided to stick to your guns and kill Scorch the moment he touched that rock, I would imagine that I would have been pretty bummed to say the least. To be killed just like that, with no in-character or out-of-character warning beforehand. But I would like to think that I would have been okay with it, or at least no longer angry, eventually, because I've read many D&D stories where things like that happen. But what if Cobbled had touched it? Obviously, a pony of his craft would be interested in such a stone, so it would make sense he would try to do something with it. Casey is new to the system. Most players here are. I don't know their experience of D&D, but I would think even experienced D&D players would lose interest in the Pony Tales system and forums if their first game introduced something that killed them like how this rock would, especially after you advertised this game for newbies...

Now, as for ignoring or misinterpreting the warning, this was my fault, and I take full blame. I knew Xel had misinterpreted the warning, and had this been a non-forum game, or one where I was warned would be dangerous, I would have corrected him OOC. But I let my inner-roleplayer take priority over my inner-meta-gamer, because I felt safe that the rock couldn't be as deadly as it turned out to be. I knew for days what I was to do when Xel gives the warning (and that was to ask for a second opinion), but when Xel made his post, I thought "Hey, you know, this could be fun." That's why I asked Lunar to give a hand. It's something Scorch would have done (since he was warned that using magic was bad, not touching it, and it was Lunar who gave the warning), as a gamer I felt safe in the game, and even thought that perhaps the pain would be divided, and finally, after whatever happened happened, I could have been all like "Oh Xel, you silly goose," and we would share a laugh into a freeze frame while the credits rolled and the live audience applauded. That's pretty much how it went in my head. So, that's my bad...

So that's basically how I feel about all this. I feel that the rock was a bad decision on your part, ignoring the warnings was a bad decision on my part, and my expectations regarding what rolls I should of had, and what the DCs of future rolls were to be should not really be used for my personal planning in the future. You may disagree with my thoughts, and I understand if you do, but I'd like to think that we've all learnt something here. Even the players that this didn't really concern, or the ones that have only just logged in today and is now all like "What the hell just happened?" What we've learnt is different between us, but I think we've learnt something...

This is the kind of discussion that would wait until after a session to discuss, but since this is play-by-post, we can do it now as well, I guess...

P.S. I rolled a 19 on the Endurance, so that's a 29. Oh well, I guess I'm being carried tonight...

P.P.S. Since magic is a life force thing, does that mean Brilliant Shimmer can assassinate people with Magecraft?

The purpose of the rock was to nullify the magic in the mind-control collars. After some thought, this purpose was expanded to "and temporarily kill Timberwolves since their magic flow and presence works differently than almost every other creature in Equestria." Thusly, this was your way to easily chop off the collars on the timberwolves, allowing them to get back up as themselves after a short period of death-esque state. It still could be if you get out, then come back once the patrol is gone or somesuch.

Since when did I not allow Arcana checks on the rock? Not only did I specifically say that the rock was shifting through a number of frequencies in terms of Arcana checks (which were frequently made on the rock), but I also once someone rolled high enough specifically said that the rock would negate magic and provided the reasoning as to why it would. Disallowing one Arcana check on a completely unrelated search for a timberwolf.

I don't know why I am being told I should have warned you guys somehow when I already did? I warned you by having Plug and Grizzle comment on how dangerous the rock seemed, did I not? I warned you by telling you that magic was required to live and touching the stone would probably be a bad idea when Lunar made his Arcana check, did I not? And did I not warn you on a meta-level by stopping you from touching it in the first place?

And Paper - your complaining about the rock killing ponies being unfair, especially in a game designed for new players, is exactly why I am doing everything in my power to keep everypony affected by the rock alive. For goodness' sake, you are complaining about how unfair it is to suddenly kill ponies when NOPONY IS DEAD


Cripes.

Spoiler:

DOUB<LE PO>ST

Xel, I get that my warning was vague and I'm sorry for that. But what you've said here...

Xel Unknown wrote:
But yeah... Only was given this rock is basically a magical black hole. The idea of it interacting in harmful ways with the magical races wasn't something we thought up until afterwards.

...isn't true.

AProcrastinatingWriter wrote:All living beings in this world need magic to live, though you don't understand exactly why or how.

This rock, from what you've understood from what has been said around you, cancels out magic.

It's not a certain thing, of course, but picking it up seems like a relatively poor idea.

TRIP<LE PO>ST

Oh, and to mitigate some of the awkwardness that is going on at the moment, no matter who is or is not at fault or in the right here,

I think we should all remember

That we all

Like

Trains

My eyes hurt from reading

You know, you probably shouldn't have let slip what the rock was for, APW...

...Also, why were we trying to move it in the first place? Seems like a rather odd thing to do, in retrospect.

Dusk Raven wrote:...Also, why were we trying to move it in the first place? Seems like a rather odd thing to do, in retrospect.

There was two goals I had when picking up the rock. In-Character, I was going to throw it at things. If it cancelled magic, then it could be used to destroy the enchantments on the shackles, and taking it with us seemed more efficient than bringing all the brainwashed creatures back with us. While even my own headcannon of Timberwolves meant that they would have died due to having their magic cancelled, I would have only done it once before going "Oops" and focusing only throwing it at ponies and others that don't seem to instantly die to it. Out-of-Character, I didn't want to stand around looking at a rock for a week, which I guess was another reason I ignored the warnings. I don't think anyone wanted to just leave the rock. It was a mystery to be solved, but no one knew how to solve it. So I took initiative, which judging by how recently I ended up in a hailstorm from doing that, is something I really, really shouldn't do any more...

Basically, everything after the initial warning (or perhaps after Lunar succeeded his Arcana check, since at the time I didn't know what the big deal if it was a magic cancelling rock) is my fault...

Dusk Raven wrote:You know, you probably shouldn't have let slip what the rock was for, APW...

Probably not, but honestly, Paper Shadow's logic about standing around staring at the rock for another week applies to me too.