Re: New Expansions - New Content - Post your favorites here

ZamuelNow Sun Jul 28, 2013 2:00 pm

I guess that's a better way of wording it.

Xel Unknown Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:22 pm

That might be true for Zummel... But I'd always ague you'll find better trait builds from picking better stuff to play with in one's build then getting more talents to play with.

Fury of the Tempest Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:37 pm

Oh yeah. Update... time to resubmit moves and such.

[+2] Nick
Target Enemy takes 4 damage, ignoring Resistance.

**Stairc -Dan Felder** Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:30 pm

Weaponmaster – Trait
While you are wielding a conjured weapon (such as Hammer of Thunder or Wind Rapier), you gain regeneration 3.

Master at Arms – Trait
Prerequisite: Weaponmaster
Reduce the cost of talents that conjure weapons (such as Conjure Hammer of Thunder and Conjure Wind Rapier) by 7 pips. This cannot reduce their cost to less than 0.

Note: Being able to constantly reuse conjured weapons should be okay, except for the occasional troublesome "this weapon vanishes" move. But I think it would work, even if the trait might need fiddling.

Fury of the Tempest Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:34 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:Weaponmaster – Trait
While you are wielding a conjured weapon (such as Hammer of Thunder or Wind Rapier), you gain regeneration 3.

Master at Arms – Trait
Prerequisite: Weaponmaster
Reduce the cost of talents that conjure weapons (such as Conjure Hammer of Thunder and Conjure Wind Rapier) by 7 pips. This cannot reduce their cost to less than 0.

Hmmm... Master at Arms work. But I don't understand why being a Weaponmaster would give you regeneration 3. Wouldn't it make more sense to have a similar effect to the Talisman of Weapons?

**Stairc -Dan Felder** Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:36 pm

Weaponmaster can be any trait that gives a bonus worth about 1000 gold and isn't made irrelevant by taking Master at Arms. I just picked regen to toss the concept out there.

Fury of the Tempest Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:42 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:Weaponmaster can be any trait that gives a bonus worth about 1000 gold and isn't made irrelevant by taking Master at Arms. I just picked regen to toss the concept out there.

Hmmm... I guess that makes sense. Still, regeneration 2 is 1500 gold, and regeneration 4 3000 gold. So 1 regeneration is worth about 750 gold, so your trait would be worth 2250 gold.

**Stairc -Dan Felder** Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:24 pm

That's odd. Sounds like those items are actually a bit underpowered unless I'm missing something. Healing is supposed to be worth about 1.5x the same as damage - and damage for a 0 pip move is 6.5+crit chance (as it assumes you roll a d12). But let's ignore the crit chance value for now and just look at the 6.5. 6.5x1.5 = 9.75. If you regain 2 health on every turn (regen 2 won't always do that if you're ever at max hp or are at-or-below 0 hp), you'd only heal 10 damage over 5 rounds. That implies regen 2 is only worth 1000 gold. If we throw in crit chance and the requirement of having a conjured weapon out, I think regen 3 is workable for 1000 gold according to the math.

**Paper Shadow** Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:25 pm

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:That's odd. Sounds like those items are actually a bit underpowered unless I'm missing something. Healing is supposed to be worth about 1.5x the same as damage - and damage for a 0 pip move is 6.5+crit chance (as it assumes you roll a d12). But let's ignore the crit chance value for now and just look at the 6.5. 6.5x1.5 = 9.75. If you regain 2 health on every turn (regen 2 won't always do that if you're ever at max hp or are at-or-below 0 hp), you'd only heal 10 damage over 5 rounds. That implies regen 2 is only worth 1000 gold. If we throw in crit chance and the requirement of having a conjured weapon out, I think regen 3 is workable for 1000 gold according to the math.

Well, the 1500 and 3000 Gold Armour use to be Regeneration 3 and 5 respectively (if I recall correctly), but they were nerfed when the Item Rework Thing was released...

**Stairc -Dan Felder** Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:27 pm

I wonder why they were nerfed. Perhaps simply because having that *much* regen can be an issue for DMs - but then the prices should have been lowered too. We did re-evaluate the value of healing after the item revamp though, so they just simply might not have been rebuffed.

ZamuelNow Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:32 pm

I wonder if it would be better to lower their cost than raise the strength so that there's more low cost items for starter builds. Perhaps lower the cost of the existing ones and add a new, more expensive item that regens more.

**Stairc -Dan Felder** Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:34 pm

I'd rather lower the cost. High regeneration, even when it's fair, can *seem* unfair to players. The appearance of balance is just as important as the reality of balance.

Fury of the Tempest Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:33 pm

So... what should the prices be reduced to then? 1000 & 2000 respectively? That makes 1 regen = 500 gold, which is much better and still allows for some stronger low-priced items.

Still, a 4k item with 8 regen wouldn't hurt that much imo.

Also, crazy idea:

Dual Conjuration
Prerequisite: Master At Arms (Tempted to have Dual Wielding be a prerequisite as well)
After Conjuring a Weapon, if you have another conjured weapon in the talents that you brought to battle, you may conjure that weapon at the same time as your current weapon for the full 7 PiP cost

Wow. That is REALLY badly worded, isn't it? Not sure how useful it would be through, I mean most items only have a standard action, and Kind says he hates minor actions on a weapon

kajisora Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:43 am

Yayy stuff!

Two racials from me this time:

Amorphous (1)
Members of your race have no solid bone structure, or are just very flexible, allowing you to fit into some very tight spaces. You may stretch and deform at will, allowing you to (for example) traverse passages normally only fit for a smaller creature. though you take a -5 to Brawn checks while so deformed. You can not change your mass or coloration using this trait, and your deformations cannot reduce the diameter or thickness of your body below Small size (such as a rat).

Multipede (1)
Members of your race have more lims than the more usual four (wings not counted). You gain an extra two limbs each time this trait is taken. This trait includes the mental capacity required to operate these limbs - a six legged creature will have no more problem using four limbs at once than a four legged creature using two. This trait may be taken multiple times

Honestly not quite sure about the cost on Amorphous. It might be a 2 pointer: in certain situations (infiltration, cave navigation etc), it could be extremely useful, but those are still pretty situational. The -5 to Brawn might also need to be a bit higher.

Multipede... On the one hand, exceptionally useful (manipulation while hanging off a ledge, carrying multiple objects, multitasking). On the other hand, how applicable it is might be very dependent on the sort of DM you're playing with.

Fury of the Tempest Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:51 am

Multipule is very fun.

ZamuelNow Tue Jul 30, 2013 1:53 pm

Wording adjustment suggestion:

Dual Conjuration:

Fury of the Tempest Tue Jul 30, 2013 1:58 pm

ZamuelNow wrote:Wording adjustment suggestion:

Dual Conjuration:

That's... good. However, the wording adjustment makes it too powerful. It should be a minor action, and the full cost.

Cardbo Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:11 pm

kajisora wrote:Yayy stuff!

Two racials from me this time:

Amorphous (1)
Members of your race have no solid bone structure, or are just very flexible, allowing you to fit into some very tight spaces. You may stretch and deform at will, allowing you to (for example) traverse passages normally only fit for a smaller creature. though you take a -5 to Brawn checks while so deformed. You can not change your mass or coloration using this trait, and your deformations cannot reduce the diameter or thickness of your body below Small size (such as a rat).

Multipede looks cool, but something similar to Amorphous is being discussed here.

Ramsus Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:19 pm

As far as I can tell Multipede doesn't do much of anything. Having extra hands yes, helps you hold more stuff but, you can do that more easily and better with Telekinesis. As written it doesn't give you any bonuses to doing anything. With Clever Tail and Spider Climb already covered, I don't think there's much for it to do. Also I don't see the point in charging people for non-standard character concepts that don't provide real benefits. And in general I don't think we should charge people for flavor features of their race. All that accomplishes is punishing anyone who wants to play a non-pony for no reason.

ZamuelNow Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:34 pm

Fury of the Tempest wrote:

That's... good. However, the wording adjustment makes it too powerful. It should be a minor action, and the full cost.

Oooohh...misunderstood. So...

Dual Conjuration:

**Philadelphus** Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:46 pm

Two combat talents this week:

[+1] Dance with Danger – Minor Utility
A random enemy becomes "Energized" until the end of its next turn. While Energized, it may make two Standard Actions per turn.

[-3] Triple Espresso – Standard Utility
You become "Energized" (save ends). While Energized, you may make two Standard Actions per turn.

As always I'm bad with names, so feel free to change them.

kajisora Tue Jul 30, 2013 3:36 pm

Cardbo wrote:
Multipede looks cool, but something similar to Amorphous is being discussed here.

Ahh, sorry. hadn't seen that thread yet. Guess I'll join the discussion ^^

Ramsus wrote:As far as I can tell Multipede doesn't do much of anything. Having extra hands yes, helps you hold more stuff but, you can do that more easily and better with Telekinesis. As written it doesn't give you any bonuses to doing anything. With Clever Tail and Spider Climb already covered, I don't think there's much for it to do. Also I don't see the point in charging people for non-standard character concepts that don't provide real benefits. And in general I don't think we should charge people for flavor features of their race. All that accomplishes is punishing anyone who wants to play a non-pony for no reason.

True enough. I think the advantage over Telekinesis is that TK can't multitask, and you can't use it to grab onto stuff, like ledges and things like that. Disadvantage is of course the range limit and that you touch whatever you're picking up. The way I see it, it would be a good combination with spider climb. Clever tail is useful for stealth, but not much else IMO, due to the penalties.
I agree about not punishing people for non-pony races, but I don't think this would do so. I'd actually want to use this for a spider character. Unless you want to play a centipede of course, but I think that is rare enough that it should be discussed between the DM and the player.

Ramsus Tue Jul 30, 2013 3:40 pm

I myself am already playing a Spiderpony and nobody really felt that having an extra set of limbs provided any sort of benefit that warranted paying anything for. All concepts are going to have some minor advantages in certain areas but, it's only the ones that actually make a real impact that need to be represented by mechanics. If you want to play a spiderpony (or other creature with more than four limbs), just ask your GM if it's ok. (Though if people are going to play spiderponies they should check out my character in Paper Shadow's Hayday campaign.)

Xel Unknown Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:36 pm

I really liked Stairc's trait idea fora conjure weapon:

Stairc -Dan Felder wrote:Here's a trait concept. Just threw together the possibility, without too much careful design, of a trait that gives you access to a more badass conjured weapon than the norm.

Celestial Spear
Once per battle, you may use the following combat talent

[-7] Conjure Celestial Spear – Minor Utility [1/Battle]
You conjure a Celestial Spear in your hands. You can dismiss the Celestial Spear as a free action. While you are wielding a Celestial Spear, you cannot use your other combat talents. Instead you may use the combat talents below.

[+3] Starbolt – Standard Attack
You deal 2d8 damage to target creature.

[+2] Starlance – Standard Attack
Roll 1d12. Deal that much damage to target creature and gain life equal to the roll result.

[-3] Starblast – Standard Attack
You deal 1d4+1d6+1d8+1d10+1d12 damage to target creature.

[-5] Starblaze – Standard Attack
Deal 3d10 damage to target creature. You and up to four allies can make a saving throw with a +7 bonus.

Also I suggest this talent again:
[-2] Armor Piercing Slap - Minor Attack [Inspired by Fury of the Tempest, Improved by ZamuelNow, Created by Xel Unknown]
Target Enemy loses 1 hp and suffers 2 vulnerability until the end of your next turn.

Hayatecooper Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:53 pm

Don't remember if I suggested anything this week

So here's some combat traits

Trait - Duel Form
When in Form of The X. You may retain one of your normal combat talents along with that form. This Trait may be taking multiple times.

Utility Talent
Hugs - 1/day
Target ally gains +3 to there skill checks for the next hour.

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